What if God doesn’t have marriage for me, how to relate to your in-laws & other rapid fire relationship questions!

Morgan May Treuil [00:00:00]:
All right, welcome back to Am I Doing This Right? Leslie and Morgan are here, and this is our last podcast with us being separated.

Leslie Johnston [00:00:09]:
Our last separated podcast. Morgan will be back in the studio next month, uh, yeah, for you guys next Monday. Yeah, so excited. I know, I know. Morgan, where are you at right now? Tell everybody. I'm in Louisiana, the great state of Louisiana.

Morgan May Treuil [00:00:26]:
Most of our maternity leave in Texas, and then we just got to Lafayette, Louisiana yesterday, and we are going to be here till Monday when we come back. And so if it starts to get dark in here, it's because I'm in a makeshift bedroom studio and it is later in the day than where Leslie is. So if you see it get dark.

Leslie Johnston [00:00:49]:
I'm so excited to have you back. Today I sent Morgan a text that was like everything that she— which obviously we've talked every week and we've texted and stuff, so I honestly, weirdly enough, it feels like you have been gone forever, but at the same time, it like— we've talked a good amount, so it doesn't feel like you're like coming back and we just like have never talked or seen you.

Morgan May Treuil [00:01:12]:
I know, you know, but it was still nice to get the, the line-by-line update of all the happenings.

Leslie Johnston [00:01:18]:
I sent Morgan a text like line by line of like every single, every single thing she's missed since she's been gone and what she needs to be prepared like walking back into. I'm like, hey, this person's dating this person now, this thing happened, like whatever.

Morgan May Treuil [00:01:32]:
I feel very prepared. I feel more prepared now than I would have. I honestly not— I didn't know most of that. So now I'm like, all right, now I'm ready to go back in. I got talking points, I'm good to go.

Leslie Johnston [00:01:43]:
I know, I was like, you kind of were walking back into like a reality TV show. There's like so many things going on, but kind of exciting, kind of exciting.

Morgan May Treuil [00:01:51]:
Come back.

Leslie Johnston [00:01:51]:
I know, we can't wait. It's gonna be so fun.

Morgan May Treuil [00:01:53]:
It's Love Month.

Leslie Johnston [00:01:56]:
If you haven't heard, if you haven't heard, it's Love Month.

Morgan May Treuil [00:01:59]:
If you haven't heard, it's Love Month. Is your, um, is your opinion that Valentine's Day is a worthwhile holiday that we should be celebrating, or is your opinion that Valentine's Day is forced?

Leslie Johnston [00:02:12]:
I love Valentine's Day. Like, I love Valentine's Day even if, like, Like, I remember loving Valentine's Day even if I wasn't dating anybody, because to me it was like such like a fun, cute holiday. I feel like I used to wake up every Valentine's Day— I think I did this in college— and I would wake up in the morning, like get up earlier, make breakfast, and I would watch that movie Valentine's Day, you know, like the one with all the different actors in it.

Morgan May Treuil [00:02:38]:
Yes.

Leslie Johnston [00:02:38]:
And I would watch that in the morning before I would have to go to class, and I think my parents were good. My dad especially was really good at celebrating Valentine's Day. So he would always send us like a little cookie— but knowing us, like, he sent us like a cookie bouquet. And so to me, it's like, even to this day, I'm like, where's my cookie bouquet? Like, come on, Dad. And so he does that for us, which is so cute and fun. So to me, I just think it's a really fun holiday. And people who are like— which, maybe Morgan, this is your your view, but to me, people who are like, Valentine's Day is stupid because like you, you shouldn't have to have a holiday to tell somebody that you love them— I just don't think I can be friends with those types of people. It's just like, it's like the same people who are like upset when something good happens for someone else, and they're like, well, this good doesn't happen to everybody.

Leslie Johnston [00:03:31]:
And I'm like, okay, like just, just take the day and have it be fun. My goodness, do we have to make everything so intense all the time?

Morgan May Treuil [00:03:39]:
I know. I feel really similar to you. This is not an unpopular opinion, this is more of just like a stance that I have, or maybe just a regular opinion. I think your parents and how they handle Valentine's Day decides what you will do with Valentine's Day as an adult.

Leslie Johnston [00:03:55]:
Yes.

Morgan May Treuil [00:03:56]:
So if you have parents like yours and like mine that make Valentine's Day like a You know, we get you a cookie bouquet or we do Valentine's baskets, or like my mom used to make, you know, heart-shaped pink pancakes or whatever. Like if they make it a thing that you celebrate as a family, then you grow up to realize that it can be Valentine's Day and still fun even if you don't have romantic love. Yes. Because there's all different kinds of love to celebrate.

Leslie Johnston [00:04:22]:
Yes.

Morgan May Treuil [00:04:22]:
My unpopular opinion. Okay. This is what I feel like might get it. May not get us into trouble, but—.

Leslie Johnston [00:04:29]:
Oh, I like this kind.

Morgan May Treuil [00:04:31]:
I think romantically you should go into Valentine's Day with zero to negative expectations about what will happen or what it will feel like.

Leslie Johnston [00:04:45]:
Okay.

Morgan May Treuil [00:04:45]:
And yeah, I think that that's definitely true if you're single because, you know, whatever, like it's better to have no expectations. And yeah, if something sweet happens, then great. But I also feel like that is an easier path to take if you're in a relationship. But people are going to think that's not a good opinion because they're going to say you should have standards or expectations for your significant other to appreciate Valentine's Day.

Leslie Johnston [00:05:13]:
Yes.

Morgan May Treuil [00:05:13]:
But my opinion is that I think life is way easier and much better if you have all holidays you have expectations towards, but specifically Valentine's Day. Feels like one of those holidays where you should just take it and just bring it like all the way down.

Leslie Johnston [00:05:29]:
Yes.

Morgan May Treuil [00:05:30]:
It just never goes well.

Leslie Johnston [00:05:31]:
Yeah. Well, and you married some— you came from a family that was big holiday people, big Valentine's Day, big birthday, big all those things. And you married someone who was very much like, that's— it's, you know, like it doesn't have to be this like huge And show. so, which is probably good. It's like you guys are like marrying— it's like you are blending these like two very different worlds that came from. And so, yeah, no, I think that's just a good rule of thumb for anything. Like, you think your birthday is going to be really fun, you get to your birthday day, and then somehow, like, you just, you know, your expectations are too high and then you kind of get disappointed.

Morgan May Treuil [00:06:10]:
You're right.

Leslie Johnston [00:06:11]:
If you just expect, like, you know what, just a regular day, then anything is— anything is great.

Morgan May Treuil [00:06:16]:
Anything is possible.

Leslie Johnston [00:06:18]:
Also, just, like, set your expectations, I guess. Like, say them ahead of time. Like, if you If you're somebody and you're like, I know that I have expectations for Valentine's Day, it's like, I don't think it like totally takes the romance out of it to be like, hey, I would love to do this or that that day, or hint at like something, the type of flowers you like or whatever. And then it's like, let them maybe not spell it out of like, hey, you need to get me flowers by this time of day or I'm gonna be upset, but maybe just maybe give the guy like a little bit of like help, because some guys I just think they just don't— yeah, they're not, they're not thinking that.

Morgan May Treuil [00:06:56]:
I think we worry that if we don't like leave it fully up to them, then we're worried that whatever they do is not going to feel like it's romance. Because I feel like for us, the romance is in the, the surprise, or like they thought of this all themselves or whatever. And the more men that I meet, the more I'm like, uh, there's— it's just this, like, whatever. If you've got a man who is like spontaneously pulling out all the stops for these holidays, and there's like surprise gifts and experiences, and that's a consistent thing. I gotta know like where they were trained or where they learned, like where are they getting this? Like the more men that I meet, the more I'm like, they're just like— it's just not— yeah, it's not in them to do this. So I feel like if you help them, it actually goes better for you, but we're hesitant to help because we feel like that takes the romance away. Yeah, but there is probably some romance to be made amongst the, the equal participation in holidays, for sure.

Leslie Johnston [00:07:54]:
Yes, where it's like, hey, this is a Valentine's Day for a guy too.

Morgan May Treuil [00:07:58]:
Like, yeah, exactly.

Leslie Johnston [00:07:59]:
Maybe like do something for him as well. Maybe he wants— maybe he wants flowers. Yeah, maybe he wants a little balloon.

Morgan May Treuil [00:08:06]:
He wants a balloon, he wants a stuffed animal, he wants flowers, he wants all that stuff.

Leslie Johnston [00:08:10]:
Did you ever have like a really bad Valentine's Day or like a really awkward, like maybe situation on Valentine's Day growing up. Did you— do you ever have like a weird Valentine's Day story?

Morgan May Treuil [00:08:22]:
I had a worst Valentine's Day.

Leslie Johnston [00:08:25]:
Oh, I think I know what you're.

Morgan May Treuil [00:08:27]:
Talking about, which you know about.

Leslie Johnston [00:08:28]:
I do know about that one.

Morgan May Treuil [00:08:31]:
We won't— we won't cover that.

Leslie Johnston [00:08:32]:
We won't cover that one.

Morgan May Treuil [00:08:35]:
Um, I don't know if I've ever had like a— like a weird— did.

Leslie Johnston [00:08:38]:
You have like a— did you have a— yeah, go ahead.

Morgan May Treuil [00:08:43]:
I was asked to be someone's Valentine in high school, and it was like kind of like a big public display because you know how you— okay, in school sometimes you would— it's like an office aide, which as a student you could like intern for the school office, and then one of your class periods you were an office aide. So you just like ran errands and delivered notes and stuff like that. And so the office aides would come in, they would bring notes about different things to different students.

Leslie Johnston [00:09:14]:
Oh God, and this like already makes.

Morgan May Treuil [00:09:16]:
Me feel so— and what grade was this in? This was in high school, but I don't remember which grade it was. And they brought in a note and it said, Morgan, will you be my Valentine? And then the guy that was asking me to be his Valentine walked in after the office aid with a bear, like a stuffed bear. Okay. And we were not dating, we were friends, we had no like romantic— yeah.

Leslie Johnston [00:09:47]:
This was out of left field.

Morgan May Treuil [00:09:49]:
It's out of left field. But I remember feeling confused afterwards because there was never really any like follow-up afterwards to know like, wait, what did this mean?

Leslie Johnston [00:09:58]:
Yes.

Morgan May Treuil [00:09:59]:
Like, which I'm trying, I'm trying to think.

Leslie Johnston [00:10:03]:
So you said yes?

Morgan May Treuil [00:10:05]:
Yeah, but then there was no result afterwards. Like, like, I, I don't know what he meant by it. I'm honestly, to this day, I'm like, man, I really never resolved that because nothing ever happened after that. I just said yes and then life moved forward and I accepted the bear and that was it.

Leslie Johnston [00:10:21]:
So this was this on Valentine's Day?

Morgan May Treuil [00:10:24]:
On Valentine's Day.

Leslie Johnston [00:10:26]:
He's like, check. Got my Valentine and we're good. Like, you didn't hang out the rest of the day or anything?

Morgan May Treuil [00:10:32]:
No, it was like, that was, that was the goal of it, was just like, be my Valentine, okay? And then that was it.

Leslie Johnston [00:10:38]:
Oh my gosh. Yeah, there was no like follow-up dating.

Morgan May Treuil [00:10:41]:
There was no like, okay, now I have feelings for you, now what?

Leslie Johnston [00:10:45]:
It was a— oh, that's so weird. It was like a tame version of a one-day stand.

Morgan May Treuil [00:10:50]:
It's a one-day high school stand.

Leslie Johnston [00:10:55]:
That's so funny. Um, when I was in college, I remember going on a date one time with this guy, and I was, I was in college, but like I was back home for something, and I like went on a first date with this guy, and I remember just being like, he was really nice, but like kind of like nothing's happening after this. Like we just, we maybe talked like a little bit after but not a lot. And I'm down at school and Valentine's Day comes around, and I— now, now, I think I went on a date in December, and this is now February, and I don't think a lot of talking had happened post-date. But I'm there with like all of my friends, we're like having a girls' night on Valentine's Day, and a pizza delivery guy shows up and he has a heart-shaped pizza the guy I went on a date with had a heart-shaped pizza sent to my house, and it had like— I, I'm racking my brain to remember what it said because it was like this like romantic phrase on it. And I was literally like, like my jaw was— I was like, what? And then I brought it in the house and all the girls are like, what? Like, you got— you went on like one date, you haven't really talked that much. And I was like, I don't know what to do. I was so freaked out that I didn't eat the pizza.

Leslie Johnston [00:12:19]:
Everybody else ate it. I gave it to the rest of the girls. Like, I felt like eating the pizza would like make me feel like I committed to this guy. And so I was just like, oh. So now they, they never let me live it down. They're like, the heart-shaped pizza arriving on Valentine's Day, which was so sweet looking back. I'm like, it was so nice, that was so awesome. But then I'm just like, in the moment was just so freaked out.

Morgan May Treuil [00:12:43]:
Did he acknowledge it? Like, did he send you a message or something?

Leslie Johnston [00:12:46]:
I think I sent him a message like, thanks for the pizza. And he was like, yeah, and I'm like, to send— like, like, we didn't live— like, we lived on opposite sides of the state, so he figured out like how to send me a pizza. I don't even— I honestly don't know how I got my address either, but probably my twin sister.

Morgan May Treuil [00:13:12]:
That is so funny.

Leslie Johnston [00:13:13]:
I think I actually have a picture of it. I should post it on our Instagram.

Morgan May Treuil [00:13:16]:
I could— did you— was there anything that resulted from it? Like, did you go on more dates or anything?

Leslie Johnston [00:13:21]:
Nope, nope, no more dates, nothing. Like, it was just— it was the pizza and then I think it was over. Probably he probably got the vibe that I was like not into it, maybe. But when you were like— again, very sweet, but yeah, I was like This was quite the gesture after a first date.

Morgan May Treuil [00:13:38]:
But do they still make heart-shaped pizzas for Valentine's Day?

Leslie Johnston [00:13:42]:
In 20-whatever it was, they did.

Morgan May Treuil [00:13:44]:
Did. They Oh, oh, I'm such an idiot. What? When you said 20-whatever it was, I was like, oh, that was recent. But the '20s have been happening since— it's probably like 24 or 25 years. 26 years.

Leslie Johnston [00:14:01]:
Exactly. Oh, but yes, Valentine's Day, we're love-monthing.

Morgan May Treuil [00:14:09]:
Valentine's Day is on February 14th, just in case nobody— if you didn't know that, which it's the same day every year, so there's no reason why you shouldn't know that. Um, but we were talking about doing some love month content, and so we put something on our Instagram for you guys, sort of like a Leslie and Morgan advice column, because We all know that you guys value our advice.

Leslie Johnston [00:14:31]:
We love to give advice even if no one takes it.

Morgan May Treuil [00:14:34]:
You just follow it to the letter.

Leslie Johnston [00:14:36]:
Yeah, exactly.

Morgan May Treuil [00:14:37]:
So we put a little question form on our Instagram of relationship situations, drama dilemmas, that kind of stuff, and we got quite a lot of questions and responses. Yeah, that I would say vary a lot in topic. And so what we're going to do is we're going to try to cover as many of them as we can, and then we'll do something similar next week. So if your question didn't get covered, then we'll get to it next week. Yeah, I figured we just go one by one and we can just address some of this stuff. And we're just— we have not really looked at these questions beforehand, so you're.

Leslie Johnston [00:15:09]:
Getting— yeah, I'm reading these as I'm looking at them.

Morgan May Treuil [00:15:11]:
I know, raw reactions. Yes, so live reactions, which can be fun, but also if you don't like what you hear, then just— we're not— we did not rehearse this. So there's that. Um, okay, first question, and we can go back and forth.

Leslie Johnston [00:15:27]:
Okay.

Morgan May Treuil [00:15:28]:
Uh, does— and we're not going to skip any.

Leslie Johnston [00:15:31]:
Great.

Morgan May Treuil [00:15:32]:
Even if it's boring, we're not— we're just gonna— we'll tell them it's boring, but we're not gonna skip it.

Leslie Johnston [00:15:37]:
Boring. Okay.

Morgan May Treuil [00:15:39]:
Yeah, let's do it. None of them are boring.

Leslie Johnston [00:15:40]:
Yeah, none of them are good.

Morgan May Treuil [00:15:42]:
First question says, desiring marriage, how to trust that God has that for you when it's not promised and the Bible?

Leslie Johnston [00:15:49]:
Hmm, it's a good question. This is like a whole big life question. This is like taking the biggest question and, you know what, we're just gonna tackle it first. But yes, um, first, what's your first.

Morgan May Treuil [00:16:03]:
Take, your hot take on this?

Leslie Johnston [00:16:06]:
So to preface it with, it is true that I don't think there's anything in the Bible that says very blatantly like clearly you will get everything that you want in life and every desire that you have will be fulfilled. And every— like, if you want to be married, like, you'll 100% get married and have a husband, or you will 100% have kids because you desire to have kids. Like, there's, there's no actual verse that says that super, super plainly. But I will say there are verses that's like, God will give you the desires of your heart. There's verses about, um, like, you know, if you ask God, like he gives stuff. I think that's wisdom. But anyways, there's lots of verses where there's a lot of promises of that God gives to us.

Morgan May Treuil [00:16:59]:
Yeah.

Leslie Johnston [00:16:59]:
But I will say, I remember feeling like, oh gosh, like What if I like really, really want this and God doesn't give it to me? And, um, and I remember talking with Charmaine Wells, who's on our staff over, um, at our adventure campus. And she, I remember she got married, she met her husband a little bit later in life. And she was like, I remember talking to her and she just with such conviction was like, if God has really put on your heart like a, a desire to be married, like, I think that he will come through in that. And she's like, if you truly feel like he has put that desire in you— now again, I don't know if like we can say just plainly like, oh yeah, it's 100% gonna happen for everybody, but I just feel like It was encouraging that day to hear her say that and not just to hear her say that as someone who was like, oh, I got married at 21. It's like, okay, if you got, yeah, it's like she actually has some experience in that and waiting for the right person. And so that was really encouraging to hear. But I do feel like God, I think it's good to pray and align your desires with what God has for your life. So sometimes I think we go really quickly into, well, here's like all of the things on my like checklist that I want, and is, is God gonna give me all those things? But I think sometimes if you like ask God for wisdom, I'm big on that cuz there's the verse that says he will give it to you without finding false.

Leslie Johnston [00:18:41]:
Like if you ask God for wisdom, like he genuinely will give it to you. Um, and then as you're praying and as you're going like, God, what, like bring out the desires that are in my heart and what is that going towards and what is What am I wanting out of life? And I think sometimes it can look like God answers those in a lot of different ways. And really it's like, okay, are you, are you wanting like a desire for marriage because you actually want to, like it wants to be a marriage? Or is it like, God, I really want to feel loved and accepted and chosen. And I think God, he probably has marriage down the line. Most, most people end up getting married. So to me, it's like marriage definitely could be a part of that, but there might be other avenues even that God is fulfilling that desire, even if right now it's not marriage. And so I think we make it really black and white, but sometimes I think it's kind of like, oh, what are your desires that are actually in you that you're trying to fulfill? And it's like, do you trust God enough to fulfill those things? Because he will fulfill those things. He says he will, but it doesn't always look exactly like you thought it might.

Morgan May Treuil [00:19:51]:
Yeah, that's a great answer. I, I think that's, that's kind of hits the nail right in the head. I think the only thing I would add, because when we're talking about the desires of your heart, we have to know that there's— when people hold God to that, which I think people should hold God to that, you have to remember that you are a flawed person with a flawed mind and flawed motives. So it's not good of God to give you everything that you want whenever you want it, right? Like a toddler that comes up to you and asks for, you know, a chocolate bar at 11 o'clock at night, it's like, that's what they want, but is that actually the best thing to give to them at that time of day? No, it's not, right? And as a good parent, you want to like show wisdom and restraint in that. Okay, so if that's the case, then we have to know that there's like a qualifying factor to this to the desires of your heart. If you— if you— if God wants to give you the desires of your heart because he's good and he's a good father that gives good gifts to his children, we have to keep in perspective that it's going to need to be like the, the God desire of your heart, right? So like, I actually think that marriage is beautiful, biblical. I think God loves it. I think God gives it to us as a gift.

Morgan May Treuil [00:21:04]:
So if you want it and you want it um, like, I don't want to say for the right reasons. I think, I think everybody goes through seasons where you kind of like want marriage for the right reasons, and then you want marriage for the not right reasons. And I think God's still graceful enough to, to give people marriage even when they're maybe not in the healthiest place with it.

Leslie Johnston [00:21:22]:
Yeah.

Morgan May Treuil [00:21:23]:
But I do think that like there's the idea that your desires of your heart have to mesh with like, what are God's desires for my life? And like you said, when you start asking for wisdom, it does feel like God begins to change the desires of your heart to be the desires of his heart for you. And when you come into that alignment with God, you might find that your desires change, or you might find that your patience changes with how God meets your desires, right? Like, it might be that your, your want goes from, well, I just want to be married, to then, okay, I'm actually— I've been spending some time with God on this, and actually I know that I want to be married, but I I have different standards for who I want to be married to. And then maybe it's just a timing difference, right? So it's like the whole desires of your heart thing is true. It stands up, it holds up with God. But there is the reality that God's a good parent and God's not going to— God doesn't desire to give you something that's bad for you or is in bad timing. So do you actually trust that God is good in the way that God defines good, not in the way that we define good.

Leslie Johnston [00:22:26]:
Yes.

Morgan May Treuil [00:22:26]:
Because I know a lot of people that I firmly believe are going to get married, but I believe that the timing of when they get married is specific. And you don't always know why it's specific until the other side, right? For sure. Um, but that's the same thing I would say for people that are trying to, you know, conceive a child, right? Like, we don't understand the timing of things until afterwards. Yes. People that are going through breakups, they don't understand. Like, there's, there's a timing to all of this that only God knows.

Leslie Johnston [00:22:54]:
Yep.

Morgan May Treuil [00:22:55]:
And the desires of your heart thing has to come into alignment with, okay, but I trust my Father knows best for his child. Therefore, I like have to, you know, kind of submit to that first. So yeah, no, marriage is not promised. But if you have that desire in your heart, I do believe that that is a blessing that God wants for you. If God does not want it for you, I do think you will learn to find satisfaction in a single life.

Leslie Johnston [00:23:27]:
Yeah.

Morgan May Treuil [00:23:28]:
That doesn't mean that you won't go through seasons of like wanting something you don't have, but generally, generally I think God takes care of hearts that are focused in trying to be fulfilled in him.

Leslie Johnston [00:23:39]:
Yeah. And everybody's life is just so different. I think even like some of the heart of this question is, is the worry of like, oh no, like I'm looking around or I'm looking at other people, like how come that person got married at you know, 19 and they never had to stress about whatever. Or you look at the person who, um, maybe they're, yeah, like newly out of a relationship, or they're, yeah, they're hurting because the person they wanted to be with doesn't want to be with them, or whatever reason it is. And I go, Christy— Christy always tells me, she's always like, we've always kind of said this phrase, but she's like, you don't— like, you do not always have to pick up the phone. Like, when fear is calling. She's like, you don't pick up the phone. Like, the minute you start stressing out about like, oh my gosh, is God going to bring me somebody? Is he going to bring me somebody? I think that's like a— the fear part of it is like a tactic that Satan uses to get you to settle.

Leslie Johnston [00:24:37]:
I think the minute you start going, oh my gosh, I'm starting to freak out because if God doesn't have this for me— which is totally natural things to think about, like, we've all been there. For everybody who, you know, hasn't gotten married like right out of high school. And I think everyone freaks out. They go, they go through that. But I think if you can go, you know what, I trust, I trust that God will provide for me and he will provide a marriage. And if it's not a marriage, then he will provide everything I need to get through all of those scenarios, which is not an easy prayer, but I think, I I think it's like to not pick up the phone of fear and jump way far ahead. I think when you start doing that a lot, you start to then settle and you start to go, okay, well, this guy's available, or like, oh, well, this one's like good enough, like I just want to be married. So, but my mom always said, she's like, it's better to be alone than wish you were alone.

Leslie Johnston [00:25:32]:
When you're with the wrong person, not that there's a one right person for you, but when you are with the wrong person I think God tries to protect people from that and he'll speak to you. But if you stick with that, I think you end up going, shoot, like, was just being married— like, was that enough for me to choose and settle for the wrong person? And it's like, you talk to so many people who have gone through the heartache of a marriage that didn't work out, or something ends up happening and they go, oh shoot, I should have listened. Like, it's better to be like, you know what, not picking up the phone of fear cuz I'm not gonna settle and I am going to wait for— and, and we don't know why God makes some people wait and some people doesn't. Like, I know so many people who have, are like, you know, in their like late 20s, early 30s, 30s, and they're incredible people and they have had to wait and maybe they got married and it's just like was later than everybody else or they're not married yet, but they really desire to be. And I go, but God, then you watch a lot of people who are really young and they get into these marriages and you're like, gosh, that looks like a terrible scenario. Or, or it's a good scenario, but like, how come they got to be married at 19 and this per— but you just go, okay, at the end of the day, like, I think it's good to think of your own situation and go, Satan is always going to try to get you to compare. He's always going to try to get you to be upset about your scenario. But I think it's good to go, okay, wait, let me take stock again.

Leslie Johnston [00:27:06]:
What are all the things that God has blessed me in my life? What are things that he's put in me, like gifts in me, things that he's doing in my life? And when you start like kind of racking all those up, you go, would you actually want to trade places with that other person? No. Like, would you actually want to be married to that person who, you know, they got married, whatever, and you're like, oh gosh, I actually don't really want that marriage, you know? Like, I think it's sometimes you just go like, okay, we got to, we got to look at our own life. You don't actually want to trade places with your life with somebody else's. And you go like, the more you can go, hey, you know what, I'm going to find— like, God, if God is good, God is not just good because you get married or because you have the baby or because X, Y, and Z happens. Like, God is good no matter what. So like, today, what is God good in, in your life? Like, what has he been good to you and, and provides for you? And just because of who he is, he's good. Then it's like, I think you can live without picking up that phone of fear all the time.

Morgan May Treuil [00:28:07]:
Yeah. Yeah. So you referenced a verse. You referenced a verse. It's 2 Peter 1:3. His divine power has given us everything we need for a godly life through our knowledge of him who called us by his own glory and goodness. So you have been, whatever your lot is, you've been given everything that you need to live life with God, which is ultimate joy and fulfillment. Mm-hmm.

Morgan May Treuil [00:28:28]:
So that's like kind of a, a rough thing to hear when you're like, yeah, but I have desires that haven't been met. But that's the reality. You have what you need because of, yeah, God getting it to you.

Leslie Johnston [00:28:39]:
And I'm just a firm believer too in like, like I'm not married yet, but to me it's like, okay, how can I live a life right now? That fully loves what I'm doing, who I'm doing it with. And so that when I get to marriage, it's not like, oh, I'm waiting to be happy because this will make me happy. Or like, oh, I'm, I'm not gonna be happy until I become, you know, a wife and a mom and those types of things. Because guarantee, if you are unhappy in singleness, you'll be unhappy in marriage.

Morgan May Treuil [00:29:10]:
And I used to think that was a myth. Like I used to be like, they're just saying that because that's what you, that's what you say, right? But I'm like, no, no, marriage actually does fulfill something in you that, that, you know, once you have it, there's a part of you that will be solved. And then you get married and you do realize like, oh no, no, like discontentment, it just changes its form. It puts on different clothes. It's, it genuinely is not it. Once you get married, you do realize like, oh, okay, like the discontentment's still here, it just looks different.

Leslie Johnston [00:29:43]:
Yeah. And like, obviously there's great things about marriage that people like, there's great benefits and all of that, but it's like, you're right. It's like we need to like focus on today and learn how to be content. That's another verse, like learn to be content in all circumstances or whatever. And I think that is really the, probably the key to life. So yes.

Morgan May Treuil [00:30:02]:
Okay.

Leslie Johnston [00:30:03]:
Anyways, great question. Love it. All right, here's the next one. Are there— this is an interesting one— are there any questions a soon-to-be fiancée should ask her future in-laws before marriage?

Morgan May Treuil [00:30:16]:
That is like— I read that and I was like, wait, I would never have thought to ask my future in-laws a question about— I wish like we.

Leslie Johnston [00:30:25]:
Had this person because I'm like, do you— like, I would just be curious, like, are you asking them questions like about her fiancé, about them, about how they parented. That's an interesting one. So I guess we'll just take it from however you take that. How would you answer that, Morgan?

Morgan May Treuil [00:30:41]:
My first thought would be— so this, and this is all contingent upon the kind of relationship that your significant other has with their parents. So if there's been relationship breakage or, you know, history of abuse or unhealth or whatever, then, you know, take this with a grain of salt. But let's say that your significant other has great relationships with their parents, good family upbringing, not perfect but good. Then one question I would be curious to ask is really like, you're talking to the people that have known your significant other for their entire life. They know their foundation, they know their history, they know all the stuff that's kind of built them and formed them. And so one question that I feel like if I could go back and ask my, my in-laws, this question would be how, like, what were you praying for in a spouse for, you know, for your son? Mm-hmm. And what are the ways that you feel like they're best loved and appreciated? I feel like I would, I would've approached that question more as like advice for how to move forward in a relationship with their child. Yeah, but I don't know if that's the question that's being asked, but that's how I would have probably approached it had I done that.

Morgan May Treuil [00:32:01]:
What would you say?

Leslie Johnston [00:32:02]:
I like that.

Morgan May Treuil [00:32:02]:
Um.

Leslie Johnston [00:32:05]:
Yeah, I mean, I heard one time the best— like, okay, so I've, I've had like a couple different experiences with like in-laws, even though we weren't married, but it like— I've had a couple longer relationships, so I really got to know all the families, obviously, and Um, I've had really good experiences and really hard ones. I think I've had some where I'm like, oh my gosh, like, I click with this family. Like, it's so easy. The mom loves me. Like, it's awesome. And then I've had some where I'm like, oh, this is hard. Like, this is really, really difficult. And it was— it didn't click and it wasn't easy.

Leslie Johnston [00:32:46]:
And honestly, part of that might have been on me. Like, I was young and just trying to figure out like having a boyfriend, all of that. And like the family aspect when you're in high school just is really intimidating. But, um, so that was on me, I think, part of it. Not all of it, but part of it. And so I remember even being like, oh my gosh, like I have to like be able to ask them the right questions. I have to like get them to like me, all this stuff. And I remember just having like a really hard experience with that.

Leslie Johnston [00:33:17]:
And then the next relationship I was in, it was like, oh, this is actually really easy. Like I already kind of had known them, so then it just like gelled and it was honestly like a pretty perfect scenario with, um, a family. And then with Michael's family, I feel like what has been so fun is that I just went into that being like, you know what, I'm just gonna like literally just be myself. Like, as hard as that is, it's like, I'm not gonna try to like be a certain person that I think they wanna be or that they want me to be. I think like, I think my sec— my second longer relationship, I think that family really healed a lot of my view of myself with in-laws because they just did such a good job of loving me. And so when I went into Michael's family, I was like, you you know what, like, I don't know them at all, but like, I'm just gonna get to know them and I'm gonna like appreciate the things about them that they all bring to the table and really like at least try my best. Because obviously I don't live near them, so it's like there's like a whole country distance away. But to me it was like, you know what, like, I'm just gonna try to be myself as much as possible and not put so much pressure to like ask the right questions and like do all the things that I'm supposed to do and all those things.

Leslie Johnston [00:34:34]:
And Honestly, it's been awesome. Like, they're amazing. Also, it's also them cuz they're just so great. But to me it's like, I think if you can just let someone be who they are, like when you're with the mother-in-law, like, are you, do you feel like you have to like button up and be like your perfect self and you have to ask these perfect questions? Or is it like, you know what, I'm gonna find out what she loves to do and like lean into some of that or like really call out what I love in their son? Or am I gonna like find out, yeah, what they love to do and be like, oh my gosh, can we do that together? Or like, let's do this together and let's have like some bonding moments. And then just being willing to put yourself in a scenario that might feel uncomfortable. Like that's the only way your relationship grows, I feel like, is if you're willing to go, okay, this might be uncomfortable because there's a lot of pressure on you because you are the daughter-in-law. It's like, okay, but how do you enter into that going, okay, I'm gonna as much as possible just be relaxed, let them be relaxed, like, and just let this kind of happen naturally. Again, if it's a, if it's like a, a normal, safe, you know, family to do that in.

Leslie Johnston [00:35:47]:
But yes, I don't know, like, I don't know if I have exact, like, questions. I think more so, like, letting them know how much you love their son. I think that is The biggest thing that will make, like, if you can call out specific things that you really love, they'll love you. Like, yeah, I just don't see them not.

Morgan May Treuil [00:36:05]:
Yeah. You know, I, I feel like too, and I, I'm not trying to stereotype guys and girls, but it does seem like if you're a girl dating somebody's son, the way that you choose to engage with the family sets a precedent and means a lot, I think. Mm-hmm. Because guys are more so. You know, they're better at leaving cleave than I think girls are. Girls are pretty attached to their family.

Leslie Johnston [00:36:31]:
Yeah.

Morgan May Treuil [00:36:31]:
And I have fantastic in-laws that like honestly blow me away because they, they are so go with the flow that they have— they seem like they have zero expectations for us, you know, like, like they never make us feel bad about, you know, not being able to do something or, you know, not being able to do something in a certain timeline. They're just so flexible. Yeah. But I do feel like if the guy is more so leave and cleave, as the girl, you might have a great relationship with your mother-in-law or even your father-in-law if you demonstrate that his family is as much of a priority. Yes. As your family is to them. Mm-hmm. And that's obviously more of like a marriage thing.

Morgan May Treuil [00:37:10]:
Mm-hmm. But I do think that like those kinds of conversations about expectations and like, what is, what does this family dynamic look like? How can we best show up and love and serve? I think the in-law thing gets a, gets a bad rap. Whenever you don't treat it with the right, like, level of communication and clarity. Because even though you're family, this isn't your family to the extent that you've grown up together. So like, with your family, you're not talking about, you know, what do I expect about this or this, because you already know, you've grown up together. Yeah. But then with your in-laws, you're like merging a brand new family in the middle of life, so you can't just assume that you know what they want or that they know what you want. You have to communicate about those things.

Morgan May Treuil [00:37:54]:
And so I feel like that's— yeah, that's, that's probably what I would say. If you're asking the question of like, what would you have asked them before marriage as a way to like create a healthy relationship with your in-laws, those are some of the things that I would say.

Leslie Johnston [00:38:07]:
Now if you're like, oh, I need to ask them some— like, especially it sounds like she's almost going to be engaged, so I, I would say it would be really, really sweet to ask his mom how she wants to be involved in the wedding. Like, how— what are her expectations? Like, how— I just think, like, so much of, like, unhealth in family dynamics are just unmet expectations and honestly unset expectations. So I think— and that goes with all areas of life. Like, when you guys have kids one day, like, what is her expectation, like, involvement? I just think a lot of people start to feel really uncomfortable when they're not brought in the loop. So I think you being like, hey, like when we get engaged, like I would love to make sure that you feel like this is just as big of a deal for you as it is like my mom. And like making her feel like, I mean, that's gonna just create a better scenario for the whole wedding. Even if you don't do anything different, it's like just letting someone know that they're a part of it. And that you know what their expectations are so you can help kind of meet those.

Leslie Johnston [00:39:14]:
And I don't know, then they'll feel loved. So I love that.

Morgan May Treuil [00:39:18]:
Yeah, I think that's awesome. Next question. Uh, this is also an in-laws question. This is funny. Relationships with in-laws, mother-in-law, father-in-law, brother-in-law, sister-in-law, especially when they parent very differently. Hmm. Interesting.

Leslie Johnston [00:39:34]:
Um, I mean, we don't necessarily have a ton of, I'll, like we don't really have a lot of experience with, you know, like us being parents with in-laws being parents, whatever. But, but I guess if it's like the mother and father-in-law too, that I guess that is, that's definitely a dynamic I think everybody comes across.

Morgan May Treuil [00:39:53]:
Yeah. I feel like, cuz we only have, I mean, as far as like other parents, we only have one other sibling that is a parent. On Benji's side, but then her kids are much different ages than where we are. So it doesn't really feel like we're parenting at this, like, the same season of life, for sure. And I actually learned a lot from how she parents. Um, but I do feel like, you know, learning your own— it's just, it's a funny, it's a funny thing because you both come from certain upbringings where you learn uh, parenting from how your parents parented you. Then you get married, you have kids, and then you kind of come together and you're like, okay, what of mine are we gonna bring into the, into the picture? What of yours are we gonna bring into the picture? And then what are we gonna create that's brand new for both of us? And then I feel like this is actually fun because we've, you know, we've been able to go back into our childhood homes basically like, you know, right after we've had Waylon. And I haven't really had any experiences where I've felt like someone was doing something in a different way than I would.

Morgan May Treuil [00:41:03]:
Like, everyone's been super helpful and really wants to learn our way of doing things versus like, you know, like, yeah.

Leslie Johnston [00:41:11]:
Like, oh, I do it this way. Yeah, yeah.

Morgan May Treuil [00:41:13]:
But it is really, it is really important, I feel like, to hold up the boundaries of like what you've established while also being really kind and considerate about it.

Leslie Johnston [00:41:25]:
Yeah.

Morgan May Treuil [00:41:26]:
Um, this is an example, and I don't, I don't feel like either of them would mind me sharing it. It's more funny than anything, but my dad's obsessed with the way that Johnson baby shampoo smells. Like, he loves it, and it's like a— for some reason, I think it's like a pillar of his parenting days. Like, he remembers bathing us in Johnson baby shampoo. Yeah. And he really, really loves that smell. But we're not doing anything toxic or like chemically for the baby, so we have a body wash that's like unscented. So it's not Johnson baby shampoo, it smells like nothing basically.

Morgan May Treuil [00:42:05]:
Um, but my dad's like really adamant that we should be using Johnson baby shampoo because he loves it, and there's nothing wrong with using it. Like, we're just just like decided to do something different.

Leslie Johnston [00:42:15]:
Yeah.

Morgan May Treuil [00:42:16]:
And so I've, I've had this, like, this situation, this people pleaser moment in me of like, should I just like wash the baby in Johnson's baby shampoo because my dad loves the smell of that?

Leslie Johnston [00:42:27]:
Yeah.

Morgan May Treuil [00:42:27]:
Or, or do I uphold the decision that Benji and I have made to not introduce any like unnecessary toxic chemicals? It's a very small example of like your people pleaser in you wants to revert back to what your parents did. Yeah, there are times where what your parents did is what you will do, and that's an awesome thing to pass down. But there's also times where what the two of you have decided is different. And when you compromise on what you've decided for the sake of like appealing to one of your parents, you break down your unit, your communication, your trust. Like it's kind of like a, it's a very subtle I don't respect you as much as I respect them. Yeah, kind of. Yeah, totally. And I— the only reason I can use that story is because it's not that serious.

Morgan May Treuil [00:43:16]:
Somebody actually doesn't care if we use Johnson shampoo.

Leslie Johnston [00:43:18]:
Yes, yes.

Morgan May Treuil [00:43:20]:
It's those kinds of decisions where you have to— I think, at least from what we've experienced, yeah, we haven't experienced a ton of it, but it's like navigating those relationships is you need to stick to your thing, but there's a way to stick to your thing you've decided without being like, yes, rude about it, or like being stuck up, or like, we know best, or being— yeah.

Leslie Johnston [00:43:41]:
Like, my way is better. Yeah, no, I think that's so smart.

Morgan May Treuil [00:43:45]:
Everyone's parenting with their way, so like, you, you can't crap on somebody else's way of doing things. But that also doesn't mean that you have to sacrifice yours when you're with them. But for sure, all of that sounds great, but if you have an unhealthy dynamic that like doesn't work, then that just doesn't work.

Leslie Johnston [00:44:05]:
That's hard. so.

Morgan May Treuil [00:44:07]:
I don't know. We're not experts yet.

Leslie Johnston [00:44:09]:
That's so funny. No, I, I think about, um, like even my own family dynamics, cuz I have siblings who have kids and they parent very differently. And so it's funny to watch, like, yeah, I think like two different brothers that are very different. They're totally different in personality. They're different parenting, like their wives are different, whatever. And what's been fun to watch though is like my parents do a really good job of this, but it's like highlighting the things that those parents are really good at. Like, hey, I'm calling out like you are awesome parents for this reason and that reason. And I think, I think when you encourage, I think it's a lot of times so easy for people to point out what they see that they disagree with or that they don't think is good.

Leslie Johnston [00:44:58]:
Or that they don't think is the best way to do whatever the scenario is. And I think if you can call out the best in people, you'll see more of that best in them. Like, I think if you spend your time going, oh my gosh, my sister-in-law, she does not know how to parent, and she da da da, she might have a list of things that she's not being a good parent in. But if you can go, okay, actually, what if I start calling out the things that I love? Like, oh my gosh, you are so good, like with I don't know, you're such, you're you're like, so good to be like present with your kids, or you're so good when you like play with them, or you're so good with discipline or whatever it is. I think when you start calling those things out, people just rise to the occasion more honestly to encouragement than to discouragement. So if you're constantly, yep, spotting everything that they do that's not good, then it's like, okay, mm-hmm, they're gonna be exhausted by you and you're gonna be exhausted by them. Now I do say you need to draw a line. I have had friends before where it's like maybe their friend, they're like, it hasn't been their in-laws, but like their friends kind of like don't have a handle on their kids.

Leslie Johnston [00:46:05]:
And it's a little bit like, okay, they don't really believe in discipline. We believe in discipline. So when our kids get together, it just creates chaos. There may be a time where like you have to draw some lines and some boundaries of like, hey, you know what, if this isn't a good environment for my kid to be in and they're kind of suffering because of it, then it's like, unfortunately you might have to draw some boundaries of like, maybe you don't spend all of your time with them. But at the same time, I think family is, family's hard. And it's like, if you can find a way to find some common ground and encourage the things that you see that are good, I think you'll have a better relationship with them.

Morgan May Treuil [00:46:42]:
That's great. I love that. Find common ground, point out the good things that you see, and then remembering like on the harder side, You only get one shot to parent your children.

Leslie Johnston [00:46:52]:
Mm-hmm.

Morgan May Treuil [00:46:52]:
So don't, don't bend, like don't make compromises for the sake of people pleasing with your in-laws. Yes. Sister-in-laws, brother-in-laws, and then neglect the parenting decisions you've made for your kid. Mm-hmm. Cuz you only get one shot to do that.

Leslie Johnston [00:47:09]:
Yes. That's, that's really good. Okay, next question. This is a good one. Dating as a Christian is so hard. What's some advice before you even begin dating?

Morgan May Treuil [00:47:22]:
My first— we could do a whole episode on this. My first totally agree option is I think a lot of people save some of their dating decisions for when they're.

Leslie Johnston [00:47:36]:
In it, when the train has left the station. That never goes well.

Morgan May Treuil [00:47:42]:
That bingo card that you made at one of your camps, was it a bingo card or was it like a.

Leslie Johnston [00:47:48]:
Oh no, it was just a lit— it was like a list of everything you could possibly do physically with somebody, and they had us write like what stage you would do it at.

Morgan May Treuil [00:47:57]:
Yes. Okay. Yeah, so that activity is so bizarre, but there's, there's some— there's like, there's a principle in there that I think is really important. It's like the— there's a scripture, don't be conformed by this world but be transformed by the renewing of your mind. Um, being conformed is passive, like it just happens to you, but being transformed comes with a decision and with you being in proximity to the one who does transform. And so I always feel like when it comes to the world and the things that we can get swept up in, it's, it's just that there are a lot of things that you get swept up in because you don't make a decision about them beforehand.

Leslie Johnston [00:48:39]:
Yeah.

Morgan May Treuil [00:48:40]:
Making a decision about what you will do in a situation before it happens is the key to making the right decision when you're in it. It's like when— did you do Dare in school?

Leslie Johnston [00:48:52]:
Um, a school near us did. Yeah.

Morgan May Treuil [00:48:54]:
Do you know what it is?

Leslie Johnston [00:48:55]:
It's like, like a dead body on a thing and they all wait. Oh God. my Maybe I'm thinking of something. Oh, I'm thinking of every 15 seconds.

Morgan May Treuil [00:49:07]:
Did we do it really different? We missed that whole week.

Leslie Johnston [00:49:11]:
It's so funny. Every 15 minutes— did you— you didn't do that in Texas? No, it was like an anti-drunk driving like campaign where they would go to schools and they would pick somebody who like dies and they would stage a car crash. And the person was like— they'd put blood all over the student and make them lay on the car, and then they'd have to go to school and dress in like all black and like sit at their desks like they're dead or something. I— it was— I never— I, I didn't go to a school that did it, but all my friends did it and it was crazy. And they'd pick like the most popular kid to be the person that dies. And so it was always like such a big deal when the person got picked. It was like, who got picked?

Morgan May Treuil [00:49:51]:
I need to know the stats of if this helped people not drive drunk.

Leslie Johnston [00:49:55]:
I know, right? And they would choose one of the students that like was the driver, and then they would have like a mock funeral where they then have to like— the parents have to write like eulogies and all this stuff. It was like very traumatic, honestly.

Morgan May Treuil [00:50:10]:
That is like— it's crazy. Some of the craziest stuff I've ever—.

Leslie Johnston [00:50:14]:
Sorry, but you were saying Dare. I'm thinking, I'm thinking something different.

Morgan May Treuil [00:50:18]:
I feel like we need to circle back. Yeah, but I can't even— I like, what are we even talking about? I feel so— I have to know so much information. No, Dare. Dare was The anti-drug, like, agenda or initiative.

Leslie Johnston [00:50:35]:
Yes.

Morgan May Treuil [00:50:35]:
We did it in elementary school in 5th grade. And they made you role play and practice saying no to drugs. Right.

Leslie Johnston [00:50:42]:
Oh my gosh.

Morgan May Treuil [00:50:42]:
And then same thing with like sex ed, right? Like you, if if we're, the, if the school's advice is abstinence, then they made us practice like how to say no to sex if we didn't wanna have sex.

Leslie Johnston [00:50:53]:
Yeah.

Morgan May Treuil [00:50:54]:
So obviously, you know, that didn't work for a lot of people, but the idea of like, hey, you know, like what would I do if this situation was presented to me is really important. I say all of that to mean that I was a Christian, grew up in a Christian home, grew up in Christian youth groups, and yet still got swept up in the passion and excitement of dating relationships and did not have certain standards that I, um, probably should have decided on before entering in. So with that being said, my biggest piece of advice right off the bat is, um, dating is not necessarily a biblical thing because of the context and the timing in which we live. And because of that, there are so many pitfalls physically and emotionally where you are presented with chances to cross lines. And all of that happens accidentally, and it happens in the heat of the moment, and it happens in the back of cars. And when you went to watch a movie at somebody's house, like, that's when it happens. Yes. So, and, and no age is immune to that.

Morgan May Treuil [00:52:00]:
So if you're like, well, I'm in my mid-30s and I'm single, and so that must apply to like young people— no, like, lust is not really something that's like just reserved for certain ages. So yes, regardless of your age and stage, your decisions when it comes to dating need to be decided upon before you start. That's one thought.

Leslie Johnston [00:52:17]:
That's really good. Um, along those same lines, I think that deciding who you date is so, so important. And I think even as just like, oh, I'm just like want to start dating and I want to start like just going out with people, and it's, it's like harmless if like we're just, you know, at the beginning and we're just dating and just like if they're not a Christian, it's like not a big deal, whatever. I would say it's incredibly important who you even choose to go on one date with. Like, not to— not to over— for my overthinkers out there, not to overthink like, I have to be in love with this guy if I'm gonna go on one date. No, like, you could have like literally no feelings and I'm still like, yes, go on the date, like, go. But to me, it is so, so easy, and I know this from experience, it's so easy to get into something when you think you're like, I'm just dipping my toe in, it's not a big deal. I'm just gonna go on a date with him even though I know he's like not a great guy or not a Christian or whatever.

Leslie Johnston [00:53:21]:
And I know the slippery slope it is once you start rolling that snowball. It's like, it's really hard to stop it once like you start dating. So I would say like, if the person is not a Christian, It's a no. Like, it is an absolute no, just for like the safety of— not, not safety, the, the safety of like your heart. Because what happens if you go on that date and you're like, I've never felt this way before, this person's incredible, they have all the right things except they're not a Christian? Or maybe they like, I don't know, like make terrible choices and you know that, and you're like, oh, I'm just gonna like— it should just be fun to go on a date. Like, I think It's just really important, like, who you end up spending time with, because you can wind up in relationships and you're a year in and you're like, wait, how did I get here? Like, I never even actually really wanted, like, a serious relationship with this person, but I just kind of, like, started— the attraction was there and all that, and then it just kind of, like, um, it snowballs. And it reminds me too of, like, Morgan, you talk about a lot of this, a lot where it's like Okay, you have like the initial attraction and that's kind of like making your relationship like progress, progress, progress. And then, then at some point it meets— what's the intersection again?

Morgan May Treuil [00:54:43]:
It's like over the course of 2 years, but it's like some way, like halfway through, attraction goes down and then attachment is supposed to take place. Yeah.

Leslie Johnston [00:54:55]:
So it's like you can actually get attached very quickly to somebody. So again, I think who you date is very important and who you choose to go on dates with. Um, I think also advice though is like to understand— and this is advice I actually would have never given before, but I think it's really, really important. I've learned that some things do change about people and some things don't. So I would say like personalities, people's kind of like things that they might struggle with don't necessarily change. Like they always say like, oh, when you, like the things you fight about early on are the things you'll still be fighting about when you're 80 years old together. Um, so I, I firmly believe that those things do not change, but I have also seen like in my dating experiences that like the guys that I've dated have changed a lot, like in really good ways. Like they have like grown, and choices that they maybe made when we first started dating, like they actually didn't— like they don't do those things anymore.

Leslie Johnston [00:56:04]:
Or they like have grown, just like we— just like I've grown in those relationships and things they've taught me. So I wouldn't necessarily— and again, this is advice like I don't want it— I don't want somebody to take this and be like, great, I'm gonna go date the crazy guy who's doing like whatever he wants. But I have watched— yes, but like even with, even with Michael, and I don't think you care me sharing this, but it's like when we first started dating, I was like, are you a little bit of like a wild child? Like you, like I feel like— and you knew Michael like when we first started dating, like I feel like there was just things where he would like, he would do stuff that I'm like I don't know if I like feel totally comfortable with that. Like, it kind of like freaks me out being like me. I'm a little more like black and white. And there were a couple things that he did that I was like, oh gosh, like, am— like, is this okay? Like, to even be dating him or whatever. And then now I look back and I'm like, oh my gosh, like, Michael would literally never do some of those things that he did back then. And they weren't even that bad, but it was like, yeah, to have a little bit of grace and room for somebody to grow.

Leslie Johnston [00:57:05]:
Like, I think Now do not settle. Like, I'm not saying settle, but I'm just saying if you have like a really good, like, kind of gut, like, Holy Spirit feel about that person where you're like, oh, actually I really do like love spending time with them, I enjoy them, I, I trust their relationship with God— if there's some like fringe things about them, those things actually can grow. So I think that's why we get so caught up on the first date being like, am I going to marry this person? Do they have every quality I've ever wanted? And it's like No, because they'll probably learn a lot from you and you'll learn a lot from them to like become somebody that you wanna marry.

Morgan May Treuil [00:57:42]:
You know, I think that's a really good point cuz the whole like you're looking for a certain person, you have certain standards and then you start dating them and you realize that there's a couple things about them that aren't what you would've chosen or their flaws. Right. Mm-hmm. The wisdom part of dating is going to be you deciphering between what is a deal breaker and then what is something that is a human flaw that can grow. Or it's like, you're not going to find a perfect person on planet Earth to marry. So if you're looking for somebody who checks all of your boxes and does not have any flaws, you are one of those people that will not get married because the person you're looking for does not exist. Yeah, I think one thing that is kind of a litmus test of whether it's a deal breaker or not. Like, obviously the deal breakers before you get married are things that are like outrageously, um, consistent character issues or things of abuse or like a, you know, pattern of unfaithfulness or like different things that are just like the things that make you feel unsafe or insecure, right? Like those are, those are pretty much like already, like those are fast deal breakers that you can be sure of.

Morgan May Treuil [00:58:53]:
But then like, you know, there were certain things that Benji and I would both say were like stuff in the other person that were like, I don't love that.

Leslie Johnston [00:59:02]:
Mm-hmm.

Morgan May Treuil [00:59:03]:
But not, not to the extent that what we were seeing made us question whether or not they loved the Lord or would be a good spouse. Just things that you're like, oh, I wish you would grow in that. That, that's—.

Leslie Johnston [00:59:16]:
Oh wait, Morgan, I think you lost audio.

Morgan May Treuil [00:59:21]:
Can you hear me still?

Leslie Johnston [00:59:21]:
Oh, I can hear you now. Sorry, you just cut out for the.

Morgan May Treuil [00:59:24]:
Last, like, for some reason it like muted me and then unmuted me. Anyways, um, what was the last thing you heard?

Leslie Johnston [00:59:30]:
You said, um, Benji and I were like, there were things that we liked and didn't like, but yeah, yeah, there.

Morgan May Treuil [00:59:38]:
Were things, there were things that we like, we would have looked at in the other person and been like, I don't love that, but they weren't deal breaker things, they were like, I wish they could grow in those things. That's, that's what we're talking about here. And I think A, recognizing people can grow and probably will grow is, you know, that's a huge part of it. So it's like, have grace in that regard. Mm-hmm. But then also I think one of the things you can, you can ask yourself is, do they know that that thing that bothers me is a problem for them? Like, do they know that they kind of have a short temper? Do they know that they're a little bit, um, they're a little bit of like a worrier unnecessarily? Do they know that they, uh, get insecure fast, right? Like, do they know those things? And then do they make efforts to grow in those things? Because I heard someone say that the only, like, one of the big qualities that they look for in a person when it comes to marriage is, are they teachable? And are they able to admit when they're wrong? If they're able to admit when they're wrong about something, odds are they're able to grow through that thing and you can see them on the other side of it. Yeah. One other thing too that I think is important, oftentimes we approach these dating relationships and we're like zeroed in on the other person.

Morgan May Treuil [01:00:52]:
I gotta make sure that they meet all these different, you know, check all these different boxes and, and they have to, you know, satisfy this, this, this, and this. We spend very little time considering ourselves and our own shortcomings in all of that. And so one thing I think would be cool, like advice before you start dating, is dating is about finding the person you want to be with, but dating is also great practice for learning how you are in relationships and exposing patterns and habits that you picked up from childhood or previous relationships. So one thing that would be really cool is if everybody went into dating relationships and focused on how they could grow it would be a game changer for healthy dating relationships because we wouldn't be busy pointing out all the flaws in each other. We'd be busy fixing ourselves. Yes. Not fixing ourselves, but you know what I mean? Like being sanctified by God who can help change some of those things about us. And then I think that would be— I mean, we would, we would find— we would— I would've had a lot less conflict in my dating relationship had I spent less time focusing on all the things that I thought were wrong with Benji.

Morgan May Treuil [01:01:58]:
And focusing more on like, what are the things that I can grow in?

Leslie Johnston [01:02:01]:
Yeah.

Morgan May Treuil [01:02:01]:
And actually fixing some of the things that I could grow in changed how I felt about some of those things that I wanted Benji to grow in. Yeah.

Leslie Johnston [01:02:10]:
That's really good.

Morgan May Treuil [01:02:12]:
Yeah. I love that. Okay. Let's do one more and then we'll cover the rest on a different episode and we'll go fast with these cuz I know that you probably have a thing after this.

Leslie Johnston [01:02:22]:
Um, I got nothing but time.

Morgan May Treuil [01:02:25]:
How— I can hear Waylon crying in the next room, which is also why I'm like, um, I can't wait till when we film and he's just like off campus and then I can— yeah, totally. I'm just kidding. Someone will be watching him and tending to his needs. Someone's watching him and tending to his needs right now, by the way, just in case.

Leslie Johnston [01:02:41]:
Oh, I think— yeah, everyone knew that. I don't think anyone thought you just.

Morgan May Treuil [01:02:44]:
Left the other him in room. Um, how to stay the path when we both met before coming to Jesus needing lots of rewiring? This is a really great question.

Leslie Johnston [01:02:56]:
It's a great question.

Morgan May Treuil [01:02:58]:
Um, one thing I will say, just kind of quick, like, encouragement story. My parents, um, went, went in on their relationship with Jesus after they had already gotten married. So they would both say that they got— they dated and got married under— in a very different spiritual season than where they were Or where they are now for sure. But then also like way different than when they even were raising us. So it is like part of God's redemption and grace and mercy that, you know, the relationship that you started does not have to be the relationship that you finish with. Yeah. So I love stories like this where you meet and maybe you both didn't love the Lord, didn't care about following Jesus, and then God gets ahold of your hearts and changes things.

Leslie Johnston [01:03:45]:
Yeah.

Morgan May Treuil [01:03:45]:
Um, I think that's totally possible. So don't, yes, don't throw in the towel on that. Like that's, that's a really cool, the rewiring you're talking about is like a joyful kind of rewiring. It's not a discouraging kind of rewiring.

Leslie Johnston [01:03:58]:
Yeah.

Morgan May Treuil [01:03:58]:
Um, but I'll, I'll let you go first if you want to. Yeah.

Leslie Johnston [01:04:01]:
Um, I think it's really cool that both, like whoever wrote this, both of them met Jesus. Like you hear a lot of times like one person. Does, and the other person's kind of against it, or the other person's just like, what? Like, what do you believe? Like, how, how is this possible? Whatever. So I think, like, what a cool thing that both of you are walking through this. But to also not invalid— like, to recognize, like, you guys are not at, like, a disadvantage necessarily. Like, every person whether they met when they're Christians or not, is walking their own relationship with God, figuring it out. I know so many people who are married, they were Christians when they met, they got married, but like one feels like farther ahead than the other, or one kind of falls, falls off a little bit, or one's like, ah, I'm like on fire for God, and then one is like, I kind of am just like busy and don't have time for that. So I wouldn't necessarily go like Oh, this is such a lack because we both met Jesus after we got together.

Leslie Johnston [01:05:10]:
Because everybody is on their own race, you know, like everybody is figuring out their own relationship with God throughout their entire life. It's like, it's just a, like a big marathon. Like you just— there's not an end point. It's like you don't reach a destination, you're like, oh, now I'm like a real Christian. Like, no, the minute you just decide, you are a Christian. So it's like your walk with God is unique and individual to yourself. So I wouldn't, I wouldn't look at that as like, oh man, this sucks. Like, we didn't, we weren't Christians before we got married.

Morgan May Treuil [01:05:40]:
Now, um.

Leslie Johnston [01:05:42]:
I think if you're not married, there are some things that maybe like you guys need to chat through of like if you're living together or like what you're doing might have to change if you want to have like a God-honoring relationship. And I think that he will bless that. Um, if you, if you do those things, but if you are married, I think some things that I've seen in other couples, like to encourage each other in their walks with God and not compare them, like to not go, oh, I'm farther along than they are. And like, they just have no idea where I'm at, but then they're doing this and I'm doing that. I think if you can, I feel like a lot of my advice right now is like encouraging each other, but it's true. It's like to encourage and point out the things that you've seen and the changes that you've seen in them and to recognize that instead of seeing the lack. Like, if you— if you're like— if the girl wrote this question, like, if you're feeling like, oh, I'm, I'm kind of maybe farther ahead than he is in his relationship, to like encourage the things that you do see him doing and to, and to point those things out in the ways that he has a far way he's come. Or if there's rewiring that needs to happen and even like how you guys handle like finances, or how you handle like going to church on the weekends, like how you handle like drinking, like how you handle like living your life in that way.

Leslie Johnston [01:07:05]:
I think getting really good mentors, like find a couple that you guys really respect, like at whatever church you go to, or, um, maybe it's just like a couple that you know who are maybe older than you and farther along in their relationship to help you guys figure it out. Because you don't know what you don't know. Like, I'm realizing with a lot of people, I'm like, oh, it's not that people are always wanting to be like, oh, I want to make these bad decisions, but they just maybe don't know what they don't know because they didn't grow up a Christian. It's like they didn't, or they don't— yeah, they, they don't have that experience. So to me, it's like getting some people to walk alongside you who are going to like mentor you. My parents were, um, they met when they were like young adults, but my dad had like just become a Christian like a few years before that. So they had really great mentors that like totally have made them who they are. So I can't stress enough, like getting in a small group, like a couple's small group where you guys are actually like learning stuff together.

Leslie Johnston [01:08:05]:
I think it's, you can obviously have like girls' small groups, guys' small groups, but I think if you can have like even a, a group where you guys can both be a part of it and learn together. That will, I think, be really helpful too.

Morgan May Treuil [01:08:18]:
What you're saying is really important cuz the last thing you want is to come to faith in your relationship and then one of you is like policing the other person, right? For sure. Like you're, you're talking about being encouraging and obviously like that's, that's, that's really a true thing for all of life. But it's like you wanna be the person that cheers them on in the relationship with God.

Leslie Johnston [01:08:40]:
Mm-hmm.

Morgan May Treuil [01:08:40]:
Not makes them feel bad for not being where you are or not taking it as seriously as you do. Like that's, that's not a recipe for a good relationship. It's not a recipe for partnership in the future. So how you handle the rewiring is really important. And I think the mentorship thing is great because, A, you're surrounding yourself with people who can help you stay accountable to what you've decided. They're people that can educate you on how to, how to conduct yourselves, right? But also now somebody else is responsible for telling your significant other stuff that you don't have to. Like, yes, I can't tell you how many times that we had a really healthy conversation about conflict in our relationship because there was a third party leading the discussion. Like, sometimes it just comes— it's— it sounds better coming from somebody who's not you.

Morgan May Treuil [01:09:32]:
Like, it just does. And I don't know why that is. I think it's just part of it.

Leslie Johnston [01:09:36]:
Yeah.

Morgan May Treuil [01:09:36]:
So mentorship is huge. And the— I think you're right. The more I live, the more I realize that maybe, maybe because Christians can be so divided on certain things, maybe non-believers, once they come to faith, maybe they genuinely don't know what the right sexual ethic is because they've been watching so many different versions of it from the outside. And so you're right, people don't know what they don't know. So the sooner that you can, A, like dig into your Bible and understand what God has said and start to follow that. And then also have somebody else who has walked with God for a while be interpreting some of those things for you too. The other thing I would say too is like, don't be afraid to then make hard decisions after that. And a lot of that will feel like sacrifice.

Morgan May Treuil [01:10:25]:
Uh, I think— I don't think this couple would mind sharing this, me sharing this part of their story, but, um, they were not Christians they ended up coming to a young adult retreat that we did, um, living together, engaged, but wedding was still a far way off. Come to the retreat, spend time with God, get to know, get to know a little bit about the faith. And then they ended up giving their lives to God that weekend, started coming to church, started feeling convicted by certain things they were hearing through the word of God, which was also really cool because what we were studying at that time was not even about relationships or sex before marriage or living together. We were actually doing the book of Exodus, which has nothing to do with those things other than we were teaching about the character of God and the will of God for your life. And so they, they just picked up things as the Holy Spirit brought it to them. So they came to me after a few weeks and were like, hey, our wedding is still like 6 months out, but God's told us that we're we're not supposed to be living together before we're married, but financially it like really doesn't make sense for us to move out. So can you marry us this weekend? Um, we're gonna do like a courthouse wedding this weekend, and then we'll do our real wedding in 6 months— or not a real wedding, but like our celebration. And I was like, man, that's actually really cool.

Morgan May Treuil [01:11:47]:
And they had to go to their parents and explain it, and their parents, you know, I don't know how their parents reacted to that. But it's like if you're doing the rewiring thing right now, just realize that there are certain things about following Jesus that are, that seem a little bit more radical and they go against the grain. And that might mean you have to make a choice or do something that doesn't make sense to people that you once sought the approval of. Or it might cost you or be a sacrifice. Mm-hmm. And all of those things are worth it and result in blessing, but you have to be willing to do those things. Yeah. And to do them together.

Morgan May Treuil [01:12:18]:
And I think that's kind of where the rubber meets the road of Okay, we both met Jesus, we're both serious about this, but now you get to know the kind of person that you're dating when you realize how serious are they about making changes that honor God. And if they respond well to that, then awesome. And if they respond not well to that, then you're learning something about the person that you are about to marry that is important information to know.

Leslie Johnston [01:12:43]:
It's really good. That's really good. And yeah, the way that it, it it seems when you, if you've never been like familiar with, you know, God and faith and all of those things, some of those things do feel like, wait, why? Like, this is so weird. Like, why would that, why, why can I not do that? Or it doesn't make sense.

Morgan May Treuil [01:13:04]:
Yeah.

Leslie Johnston [01:13:04]:
But I think that you do watch time and time again, like the proof is in the pudding. Like there's like so many stories that you've heard where it's like, oh, this couple like stopped doing this. They stopped living together and then, or they got married or they did whatever. And it's like, the ways that God has blessed them and their relationship and just kind of like the, the sacrifice that takes, I think God honors. So it's worth it. And yeah, so, but I think surrounding yourself with people who can encourage you both in that is gonna be huge. okay, So, well, this has been really fun. We have so many more questions to get through on another episode.

Morgan May Treuil [01:13:41]:
I am excited for those next week. Oh my gosh, wait, one thing we're supposed to talk about is Thrive.

Leslie Johnston [01:13:47]:
Yes, Thrive Conference coming up. Yes, end of April, early May. Um, there is a Thrive Conference. Actually, our team puts it on and we have a blast. It's like 3 days. There's like an advanced ministry training day and then a 2-day conference. So whether you're in ministry, not in ministry, you're in business, leadership, Um, any of those things, this conference is for you. And this is not a boring stuffy conference.

Leslie Johnston [01:14:15]:
This is like so fun. We play this game at Thrive where like Morgan has to go into the, like go into the courtyard lobby area and we play that game from like Ellen or something where we're in her ear and she has to do really embarrassing things in the courtyard and it's all on video. It's so fun. There's like incredible speakers, John Maxwell, Carrie Newhoff. Um, Levi Lusko just signed on to come with us, um, for Thrive. So we're super excited. It's going to be awesome. You can sign up today.

Leslie Johnston [01:14:45]:
Don't come alone.

Morgan May Treuil [01:14:46]:
If you decide to come and you come, you're coming because you're a follower of Am I Doing This Right, then you should DM us and tell us. We'd love to buy you a coffee or hang out with you a little bit while we do.

Leslie Johnston [01:14:58]:
That's right. Morgan and I will be doing a breakout on something. We're going to come up with what we're going to talk about. Tell us what we should talk about at Thrive. But yes, so you can go to thriveconference.org, buy your tickets, and we will see you at Thrive. But okay, yep. Well, we love you guys. We will be here next Monday, both of us in person.

Leslie Johnston [01:15:20]:
I say that right now as Morgan's video is like glitching. I can— she's like barely see her. But we're so excited, Morgan, to have you back, and I can't wait. We love you all. Happy Love Month. Schedule, schedule your cookie bouquets to come to yourself if you're single. It's worth it.

Morgan May Treuil [01:15:35]:
Or your, your Valentine's pizza, your Valentine's heart shape.

Leslie Johnston [01:15:39]:
Send the pizza. Moral of the story, send the pizza. Oh, love you guys. See you next time.

Morgan May Treuil [01:15:47]:
Bye.