Leslie Johnston [00:00:00]:
All right, welcome back to Am I.
Morgan May Treuil [00:00:01]:
Am I doing this right? We are your hosts, Morgan and Leslie. You look really cute. I like your outfit today. This is very fall.
Leslie Johnston [00:00:10]:
Thank you. I love your hair. Hair reveal.
Morgan May Treuil [00:00:13]:
Hair reveal.
Leslie Johnston [00:00:15]:
Looking for a bob.
Morgan May Treuil [00:00:16]:
Bob.
Leslie Johnston [00:00:17]:
I don't know that song.
Morgan May Treuil [00:00:18]:
Actually.
Leslie Johnston [00:00:18]:
I hear it on Tick Tock. I know the words.
Morgan May Treuil [00:00:20]:
I wish that. That's kind of the only. The only trend right now that just sticks in my mind is that one.
Leslie Johnston [00:00:26]:
Yes, guys, Morgan got a cute bob. So if you haven't switched on over to Spotify, do so now so you can see. So you can see her bob.
Morgan May Treuil [00:00:33]:
What all the hype is about. Wait.
Leslie Johnston [00:00:34]:
Okay.
Morgan May Treuil [00:00:34]:
Shorter than I thought it was.
Leslie Johnston [00:00:35]:
Tell us. Tell us why. Why you got the bob. What inspired it?
Morgan May Treuil [00:00:40]:
I don't know that I have, like, great inspiration for hair. I don't think about it a whole bunch before I do it. I feel like I get the. The impulse to change something. Yeah. And then I just go and then change it. However, I do like short hair that has become something recently in the past few years that I really like. And then this is the shortest that I've gone.
Morgan May Treuil [00:01:02]:
But I've seen some really cute girls styling it online.
Morgan May Treuil [00:01:08]:
Yep.
Morgan May Treuil [00:01:08]:
And they do the little half, half down, and they do, like, a little flip. And so anyways, I just was like, let's just send it. And it's kind of nice to have it out of the way before the baby comes. And the mom chop. The mom chop. The premature mom chop is what I did.
Leslie Johnston [00:01:24]:
That's right. But it's cute and it's.
Morgan May Treuil [00:01:25]:
Did you get your hair done?
Morgan May Treuil [00:01:26]:
No.
Morgan May Treuil [00:01:27]:
It looks like it's got color in it recently.
Leslie Johnston [00:01:29]:
Really? Nope. It's just long and uncut.
Morgan May Treuil [00:01:34]:
I really like it.
Leslie Johnston [00:01:35]:
It's at that phase Morgan and I always talk about. We know when we're. Hair is unhealthy because you can stand it up and it doesn't fall over.
Morgan May Treuil [00:01:43]:
It's been.
Leslie Johnston [00:01:44]:
Your hair would really fall over right now.
Morgan May Treuil [00:01:46]:
My hair would. Well, if I could even flip it up. That's the thing is, like, it's like, no longer flippable, which is kind of scary.
Leslie Johnston [00:01:52]:
Let's. So cute.
Morgan May Treuil [00:01:53]:
I got home last night, and Benji was like, whoa, it's really short. Which I feel like guys have a thing about short hair.
Morgan May Treuil [00:01:59]:
Yeah.
Morgan May Treuil [00:01:59]:
Like, would your boyfriend Michael?
Leslie Johnston [00:02:01]:
Michael begs me to cut my hair short.
Morgan May Treuil [00:02:04]:
He likes short hair. Loves. That's very different for. I feel like usually guys are not into short hair.
Morgan May Treuil [00:02:09]:
Yeah.
Morgan May Treuil [00:02:10]:
I wonder what that is about guys.
Leslie Johnston [00:02:12]:
I don't know. But I feel like. This is a funny way to say it. The last couple boyfriends I've had, I feel like they all like short hair. That's like, you should cut your hair short. And I'm like, I. Yeah, I would think that's not normal.
Morgan May Treuil [00:02:23]:
Yeah, I would.
Leslie Johnston [00:02:24]:
Don't think it's normal. But I think both of them were like, a little trendier.
Morgan May Treuil [00:02:27]:
So they, like, stand fashion.
Leslie Johnston [00:02:29]:
They understand what's, like.
Morgan May Treuil [00:02:30]:
Cool.
Morgan May Treuil [00:02:30]:
Yeah, I think. I think that Benji's still like, of the mindset that if I had long hair and then wore skinny jeans, then that would be still peak, peak attractiveness.
Leslie Johnston [00:02:40]:
That's so. I don't understand. I know.
Morgan May Treuil [00:02:43]:
So bad.
Leslie Johnston [00:02:44]:
Well, I love it. I think it's so cute.
Morgan May Treuil [00:02:45]:
I love your fit. I love your hair too.
Morgan May Treuil [00:02:47]:
Thank you.
Morgan May Treuil [00:02:48]:
We are in the first episode release of Fall.
Leslie Johnston [00:02:50]:
That's right.
Morgan May Treuil [00:02:51]:
It's officially October, which I guess it depends on when you personally believe that fall starts.
Leslie Johnston [00:02:57]:
I mean, if people don't think fall starts now, then.
Morgan May Treuil [00:02:59]:
No, they should think fall starts now. But if they are on, like, the Starbucks schedule, then maybe they've been in fall mode for a little bit. But, like, October is like, the undeniable fall.
Leslie Johnston [00:03:08]:
When. When's your fall in your mind start? Like, when's your fall start and when's your Christmas start?
Morgan May Treuil [00:03:15]:
To me, Christmas starts at November 1st, because I feel like Christmas needs more time than it gets. One month is not enough for Christmas.
Leslie Johnston [00:03:24]:
That's true.
Morgan May Treuil [00:03:25]:
But I think fall for me probably starts right now in October. To me, September. Everywhere I've ever lived, September still feels like summer. So it's hard to get in the spirit of something. Like today is raining, and it's, like, kind of chilly.
Morgan May Treuil [00:03:41]:
Y.
Morgan May Treuil [00:03:41]:
This is the first time where we've actually had temperatures that feel like fall versus just summertime heat. Yeah, we've still been in summertime heat mode.
Leslie Johnston [00:03:50]:
When did it start? 300 degrees, like a week ago. I feel like. Yeah. To me, September, when I was little, used to feel like fall because you start school the minute school's over. I feel like I'm still in summer in September. I'm definitely not ready for fall. October 1st, though, is like.
Morgan May Treuil [00:04:05]:
Yeah, it's just magic. It's magical.
Leslie Johnston [00:04:08]:
And it's a little bit magical. I hate. I don't like the rain, though. I think the whole thing is a waste.
Morgan May Treuil [00:04:13]:
Well, it doesn't rain very much here, which is great.
Leslie Johnston [00:04:16]:
I was driving to work today, and I was like, if I lived in Seattle, I don't. I just couldn't do It.
Morgan May Treuil [00:04:21]:
There's nothing about today that made you feel like, oh, this is fun. It's something different last night when it.
Leslie Johnston [00:04:26]:
Was raining when I was going to bed. I love that. And I liked that it was cloudy yesterday. To me, rain just, like, kind of ruins things.
Morgan May Treuil [00:04:33]:
I think if you're planning on being home, there's something fun about that. Yes. You get out, you're like, this is the worst.
Morgan May Treuil [00:04:39]:
Yeah.
Leslie Johnston [00:04:40]:
But I also think rain and fall, they're great for like, a day.
Leslie Johnston [00:04:46]:
Yeah.
Leslie Johnston [00:04:46]:
But to me, I like to be outside. I think people who really like to be inside are like, this is my favorite season because I get an excuse to be inside.
Leslie Johnston [00:04:53]:
Yes.
Leslie Johnston [00:04:54]:
And no one else is outside, so I'm not having fomo.
Morgan May Treuil [00:04:57]:
Cozy vibe.
Leslie Johnston [00:04:57]:
It's cozy.
Morgan May Treuil [00:04:58]:
People like cozy vibes. Yes.
Leslie Johnston [00:04:59]:
You're.
Morgan May Treuil [00:05:00]:
You're kind of a summer girl.
Leslie Johnston [00:05:01]:
I'm kind of a summer girl. But you're a fall girl, and I love that.
Morgan May Treuil [00:05:05]:
I love. This is, like, my favorite name is be good. I do love it. I love fall and I love just.
Leslie Johnston [00:05:15]:
I love it. Well, speaking of fall, in. In. In light of. Or in lieu, I should say in lieu of. In lieu of doing an unpopular opinion, I have some fall. Would you. Well, okay.
Leslie Johnston [00:05:27]:
Some are fall, some are not fall, some are random. Would you rather. Questions.
Morgan May Treuil [00:05:31]:
Okay. You have to answer them too.
Leslie Johnston [00:05:32]:
Okay.
Leslie Johnston [00:05:33]:
Again, only, like, one of the. Actually, only two of these are fall related. But the other ones I thought. The other ones I thought were funny in some way.
Morgan May Treuil [00:05:39]:
Fall a bit in other ways. Not at all.
Leslie Johnston [00:05:41]:
Okay. Would you rather go to a haunted house where the actors can touch you, or host a friendsgiving and everyone arrives and there's no food and you're hosting.
Morgan May Treuil [00:05:53]:
But they came with the understanding.
Leslie Johnston [00:05:55]:
Understanding you were providing food.
Morgan May Treuil [00:05:58]:
Oh, my gosh. I still think I would rather host the party with no food. Because being in a haunted house where people can touch you is just not okay.
Leslie Johnston [00:06:12]:
I think.
Morgan May Treuil [00:06:12]:
What would you do?
Leslie Johnston [00:06:13]:
Getting whatever you have that fear of. Of always, like a stranger walking by and they, like, bump you.
Morgan May Treuil [00:06:18]:
Yeah.
Leslie Johnston [00:06:19]:
Think like they've injected you.
Morgan May Treuil [00:06:20]:
Yeah.
Leslie Johnston [00:06:21]:
That would be like, on an extra.
Morgan May Treuil [00:06:24]:
Oh, I'd rather disappoint people than be touched by a monster in a haunted house.
Leslie Johnston [00:06:29]:
Haunted house.
Morgan May Treuil [00:06:30]:
I think you would rather be touched by a haunted house person than host a dinner party where you were supposed to bring food, but there's no food.
Leslie Johnston [00:06:37]:
How horrible is that? People get there and you're like.
Morgan May Treuil [00:06:39]:
That surprises me about you because, like, I'm more of a people pleaser than you are, and it's like, yeah, but, like, do you want to be grabbed at a haunted house by a stranger?
Leslie Johnston [00:06:48]:
Okay. I went to this haunted house thing one time, which I don't like anything haunted. Morgan will watch a scary show. I won't even watch a scary show. But I went with a friend to this haunted house thing out in the middle of nowhere, and it was trailers, and they converted this trailer park into a haunted house. Like, this weird haunted, like, experience where you could walk around.
Morgan May Treuil [00:07:10]:
Are you going into the trailers?
Leslie Johnston [00:07:11]:
You're going into the trailers? I didn't even make it into the trailers.
Morgan May Treuil [00:07:14]:
This is horrifying.
Leslie Johnston [00:07:16]:
So I walk around with my friend. It's literally horrifying. It's at the middle of the night on Halloween, and I'm like, why are we even here? This is so gross. And people are touching you. Like, they could do everything. Oh, not everything, but, like, they jump at you and push you and whatever. And so we got out of there really quick. So I was like, this is terrifying.
Leslie Johnston [00:07:35]:
Only to realize that I couldn't find my license after that. And I was like, I think that the last time I remember having it was in the haunted house area. So we drove all the way back, and I had to go through the haunted house again to my license on the ground.
Morgan May Treuil [00:07:50]:
Did you find it?
Leslie Johnston [00:07:51]:
Yes.
Morgan May Treuil [00:07:51]:
Where was it on the ground? It had just fallen out of your wallet.
Leslie Johnston [00:07:55]:
Fallen out of my wallet. And nobody took it? Like, someone, I think, returned it, But I had to walk through the haunted house again and relive it.
Morgan May Treuil [00:08:02]:
Oh, my gosh. I've never heard you tell this story before.
Leslie Johnston [00:08:06]:
It was. It was horrifying.
Morgan May Treuil [00:08:07]:
Do we s. Did people sign something going into these haunted houses where you can be touched?
Morgan May Treuil [00:08:12]:
Yeah.
Leslie Johnston [00:08:12]:
I think there's a theme park, too, that does this where they do, like, a haunted night.
Morgan May Treuil [00:08:17]:
Who subjects themselves to this stuff?
Leslie Johnston [00:08:20]:
I. Apparently I did.
Morgan May Treuil [00:08:21]:
This is some crazy. Like, I. This is wild. And I can't imagine going back through. I'd be like, sorry. I go to the DMV tomorrow, and.
Leslie Johnston [00:08:29]:
It must get a new life adrenaline thing, because to me, like, I don't understand. I don't want to watch a scary movie. I don't want. But I love, like, a roller coaster. So to me, I just would imagine maybe people like that adrenaline feeling.
Morgan May Treuil [00:08:42]:
So you like the adrenaline feeling of being scared in person but not watching a movie on your own couch? Probably, yeah. That's. That's psychologically very interesting.
Leslie Johnston [00:08:54]:
I mean, I don't like. Like going to a haunted house.
Morgan May Treuil [00:08:57]:
You love haunted houses.
Leslie Johnston [00:08:58]:
But to me, I would rather. I would rather probably go to a haunted house as long as I knew there wasn't, like, an actual spirit then. Then watch, like, a creepy movie for some reason. That is we.
Morgan May Treuil [00:09:09]:
But I wonder why that is. Because I feel the exact opposite of that. I don't know why that's crazy.
Leslie Johnston [00:09:15]:
Okay, here's my next one.
Morgan May Treuil [00:09:16]:
License. Funny. A slice and store is funny, which.
Leslie Johnston [00:09:19]:
This one's funny. Would you rather accidentally like your ex's pumpkin patch photo from 2017 or show up to a Halloween party but you and your significant other is dressed up as your exes and his new girlfriends? Like, you have the same costume on.
Morgan May Treuil [00:09:38]:
As your ex and their new girlfriend?
Leslie Johnston [00:09:39]:
Yep. So same couple's costume.
Morgan May Treuil [00:09:43]:
I think I would rather show up in the same costume because we could be like, oh, this is funny, versus, like, if I'm liking your photo from 2017, then they think, okay, you're obsessed with me.
Leslie Johnston [00:09:55]:
What if you get to the party and she's like, a model and she's wearing the same.
Morgan May Treuil [00:09:58]:
Oh, I can guarantee you she probably looks awesome and I'm looking like the great value version of it.
Leslie Johnston [00:10:04]:
I agree with you.
Morgan May Treuil [00:10:05]:
I still feel like I would rather.
Leslie Johnston [00:10:07]:
Show up with the same costume on.
Morgan May Treuil [00:10:08]:
I think, because you can't. You can't.
Leslie Johnston [00:10:10]:
There's no getting out of the 2017.
Morgan May Treuil [00:10:12]:
2017 photo. Gosh. Like, you just revealed your. All of your cards.
Leslie Johnston [00:10:17]:
Have you ever done that? Have you ever accidentally, like, liked or commented on something?
Morgan May Treuil [00:10:22]:
No. But you know that feeling when your dad or your grandmother or your aunt or mom or somebody asks to see your phone.
Leslie Johnston [00:10:29]:
Yes.
Morgan May Treuil [00:10:30]:
To look at someone else's thing on Instagram, and you're literally holding it up to them, and you're like, don't touch this. And they're grabbing and trying to scroll because you're so scared they're going to like something.
Leslie Johnston [00:10:42]:
My dad is. He. If someone ever gives them their phone, he just swipes. Like, he's like.
Morgan May Treuil [00:10:49]:
Like, I can't tell you what's happened or what you've. Like, don't let go.
Leslie Johnston [00:10:53]:
Yeah, don't let go of that phone.
Morgan May Treuil [00:10:54]:
You cannot let go of it. It's.
Leslie Johnston [00:10:56]:
He one time grabbed. Not my friend, like, was showing him one of her photos and she gave him. And it's because he's so naive. Like, I. Like, he would do the same thing. Like, he would give his phone to someone else. Like, apparently, that's how trusting he is.
Leslie Johnston [00:11:10]:
Yeah.
Leslie Johnston [00:11:10]:
And so she hands the phone to him and he starts swiping because he thinks, oh, there's more of these. Like, you're showing me a photo. There's probably more. It's probably like, a hundred. It's a photo album. And he scrolls over, and it's a positive pregnancy test. And she had not told that she was pregnant yet.
Morgan May Treuil [00:11:28]:
Did she. Did he see it?
Leslie Johnston [00:11:30]:
He must have seen it, but she was like, I think that he saw it. Whatever.
Morgan May Treuil [00:11:33]:
So then he didn't say anything.
Leslie Johnston [00:11:34]:
He didn't say anything. He just acted like nothing happened.
Morgan May Treuil [00:11:37]:
Gosh. See, it's like I feel. I feel for them because in their minds, it's like a phone's just a phone, right? Like, I can hide, like, but we're all just like, there's a bunch of landmines and all these little apps and social nuances don't mess up.
Leslie Johnston [00:11:50]:
Isn't that funny? Like, I don't know what it is, but if. Even if either my parents, like, grabbed my phone and started clicking around, I. I actually don't have anything to hide. I still feel like, what are you gonna find?
Morgan May Treuil [00:12:01]:
It's not about what. It's not about hiding or. Or even, like, what they. What they will find to me. It's about what they could accidentally do. I'm just terrified of them, honestly. Any social media apps? Because I don't clean those up very much. So, like, it's not like I'm adjusting friends, you know? Like, I'm still friends with all these different people on social media, so it's just like, oh, gosh, are they gonna like something or comment something or.
Leslie Johnston [00:12:25]:
That is a universal experience. Like, you do not touch it even to, like, you. Even if I had my phone, I'd be like, don't touch it.
Morgan May Treuil [00:12:33]:
You just, like. You're like this.
Leslie Johnston [00:12:35]:
Yeah.
Morgan May Treuil [00:12:35]:
You're like.
Leslie Johnston [00:12:35]:
You can look and do.
Morgan May Treuil [00:12:37]:
I'll scroll for you. Just tell me how far you want me to go up.
Leslie Johnston [00:12:39]:
Oh, it's so funny.
Morgan May Treuil [00:12:40]:
So funny.
Leslie Johnston [00:12:41]:
Okay. Would you rather sleep with a loud snore or a blanket hog?
Morgan May Treuil [00:12:46]:
Okay, well, not to blast anybody right now, but I am the most exhausted I've ever been right now because we have a huge problem in our house. Okay.
Leslie Johnston [00:12:56]:
What is it?
Morgan May Treuil [00:12:57]:
Benji is snoring all night long.
Leslie Johnston [00:13:00]:
Has he ever snored before?
Morgan May Treuil [00:13:02]:
Yes, but it's. It's kicked into high gear recently, and I can't. I can't sleep at all.
Leslie Johnston [00:13:09]:
I'm really terrified for that, honestly, when I get married.
Leslie Johnston [00:13:12]:
Yes.
Leslie Johnston [00:13:12]:
Like, what happens if they snore? And you have no idea.
Morgan May Treuil [00:13:15]:
We should all be talking about this before we get married. I'm Just kidding. It wouldn't change anything. But I remember we first got married. He was having snoring issues. We put a sound machine on top of our headboard in the middle of us, and then we turned it on to see if the white noise could drown out his snoring. It kind of helped, kind of didn't. Then we tried nasal strips.
Morgan May Treuil [00:13:34]:
We tried all kinds of stuff. Then eventually I think he just gave up. And he's like, well, it affects me in no way. And usually I'm a pretty deep sleeper. So when I'm out, I'm out. It doesn't bother me.
Morgan May Treuil [00:13:44]:
Yeah.
Morgan May Treuil [00:13:45]:
But I. I wake up like mostly every night. I wake up every two hours right now because I have to pee or because there's like heartburn or I'm hung or I'm uncomfortable. And then it's like when you're up and you're hearing sounds. So I would rather sleep with any other kind of. Of inconvenience except snore. Snoring. For some reason, the sound is just like.
Morgan May Treuil [00:14:10]:
Even when it's a quiet snore.
Morgan May Treuil [00:14:12]:
Yeah.
Leslie Johnston [00:14:13]:
No. If I've ever had to share a room with someone who snores, they're actually like. I don't know what it is because we, we all like white noise.
Leslie Johnston [00:14:21]:
Yes.
Leslie Johnston [00:14:22]:
And that's a noise. And it can be loud, but I think it's consistent.
Leslie Johnston [00:14:26]:
Yeah.
Leslie Johnston [00:14:26]:
There's something to storing that. It's just not quite consistent enough.
Leslie Johnston [00:14:30]:
Yes.
Leslie Johnston [00:14:30]:
So it's so agitating.
Morgan May Treuil [00:14:32]:
Yes, agitating. So you can't. You can't get used to it. Wait, would you rather.
Leslie Johnston [00:14:36]:
Are there like nose strips or something that people can wear these?
Morgan May Treuil [00:14:38]:
I'm sure, I'm sure it would just require some selflessness and sensitivity to be able to consider that. Wait, would you. Would you rather do a bed covers hog or a.
Leslie Johnston [00:14:52]:
I mean, probably. I would rather be with a blanket hog. But that also sounds so obnoxious as well. Like you wake up and you're freezing. Because I have shared a bed with my sister and like, apparently I have stolen the blanket. But like, you just know when someone like puts the blanket under their arm and they just turn over and it just takes it away. And I remember like pulling the blanket back from her. And there is something to me that feels like incred.
Leslie Johnston [00:15:22]:
Snoring. There's no inconsiderateness about it necessarily because they're not trying to me. Like there is a moment when you're sharing a bed where like, you could grab the blanket and you're doing it on purpose. Because I have felt that with Christy before. I'm like, you took that blanket on purpose, and I know you did. So to me, I think that would agitate me.
Morgan May Treuil [00:15:41]:
That is annoying. But that feels more intentional. You're trying to hurt me. You're trying to hurt me.
Leslie Johnston [00:15:47]:
Okay. Would you rather. These are more relationship ones.
Morgan May Treuil [00:15:51]:
Okay.
Leslie Johnston [00:15:52]:
Would you rather be ghosted after three months or love bombed for three weeks? And for those that don't know what love bombing is, it's like when someone just goes way too fast and way too, like, spilling their guts out about how much they love you too quickly.
Morgan May Treuil [00:16:10]:
We should talk about this.
Leslie Johnston [00:16:12]:
Let's do it.
Morgan May Treuil [00:16:13]:
Like love bombing and ghosting.
Morgan May Treuil [00:16:16]:
Yeah.
Morgan May Treuil [00:16:17]:
These are two extremes, I feel like, that we see in what I. What. What are you. What's your take on that?
Leslie Johnston [00:16:26]:
Well, I mean, it's two very different things. My first thing is, like, of course I'd rather be love bomb for three weeks than be into someone and then they ghost me. But at the same time, something about the love bombing thing, like, if I've ever started dating someone and they're way too in it, way too fast, I always am. Like, at first, you're slightly flattered because you're like, oh, they really like me. But then to me, I've always been like, but do you just really want a girlfriend or do you just really need someone?
Leslie Johnston [00:16:59]:
Yeah.
Leslie Johnston [00:16:59]:
And I'm, like, filling that spot. Like, to me, that doesn't actually make me feel good. It makes me feel a little, like, used.
Leslie Johnston [00:17:06]:
Yes.
Leslie Johnston [00:17:07]:
Not in, like, a really bad way, but just in a way where it feels like I want you to love me for me.
Leslie Johnston [00:17:12]:
Yeah.
Leslie Johnston [00:17:12]:
After getting to know me. And if you don't know me well enough, you can't be like, oh, you're the best thing that's ever happened to me.
Morgan May Treuil [00:17:19]:
What's the healthy pace of communication when you first start dating somebody that makes you feel confident that they like you, but not like, love bombed or it's, oh, it can be over saturated.
Morgan May Treuil [00:17:34]:
Yeah. Yeah.
Morgan May Treuil [00:17:35]:
Like, what's the. What's the healthy pace that I feel like we are in a time right now culturally and. And maybe even throw in the Christian church just because I think Christians are on a racetrack to get married where it feels like we don't have great pacing when it comes to beginning a relationship. Communication. We're either racing to the.
Leslie Johnston [00:17:56]:
To the.
Morgan May Treuil [00:17:57]:
I'm not even saying raising to the altar. We, like, immediately go so deep and so committal with our language.
Morgan May Treuil [00:18:04]:
Yeah.
Morgan May Treuil [00:18:04]:
And it's very affirmation. Driven. This is the greatest thing I've ever experienced. You know, it feels different with you, but it's all happening really fast.
Morgan May Treuil [00:18:14]:
Yeah.
Morgan May Treuil [00:18:14]:
And you can't figure out why. Or it feels like oddly spaced out, few and far between. Kind of like the making you guess and question.
Leslie Johnston [00:18:24]:
Yes.
Morgan May Treuil [00:18:25]:
Like you don't know when your plans are to hang out because the ball is kind of like completely in their court. And then you're just waiting to. So what's, what's the healthy pace for? For. Because I know lots of people and there's lots of people that are single listening to this, that are curious. Like, what, what am I supposed to be looking out for? This is like the first taste of them that you get when you start eating them. I don't know what, what the healthy rhythm is.
Leslie Johnston [00:18:50]:
Well, to me, I think it's important to go at least when you're checking with yourself because I think we can be like love bombing people and then you can meet people who are that way. But I think if you can be aware of like, okay, what was happening before I got in this relationship, like, was I okay? Was I fine being by myself? Like even hopeful for a relationship, but I was okay being alone or was I just like, oh, like I'm. No, I'm not feeling okay being single or not being with somebody. Because then when someone comes in the picture, are you going, you know what? I'm good on my own. Unless, like God gives me the right person. Or are you, like, I'm not good on my own. So if somebody comes into my path, I'm going to latch on because this has to work. Because I'm not okay if it doesn't work.
Morgan May Treuil [00:19:47]:
That's a really good point. So you have to. The only way you're gonna be able to see clearly through whatever it is, communication wise, they're bringing into the picture, whether they're doing the love bomb thing or the ghosting thing.
Morgan May Treuil [00:19:57]:
Yeah.
Morgan May Treuil [00:19:58]:
Is. What state were you in before?
Leslie Johnston [00:20:00]:
Yes. I think about which we just had them on, actually. Joey and Christy. Christy was dating a guy for a long time. They had broken up. She never felt like she, she knew, like, probably that wasn't going to be her husband.
Leslie Johnston [00:20:13]:
Yeah.
Leslie Johnston [00:20:14]:
But they broke up and then for a while she was single and she felt like, man, I. She had come to the terms, like, I would love to be married, but, like, I'll probably be single. Like, she just got to that point where she's like. And that's okay. Like, God, God will provide my needs, all that kind of stuff. And then she met Joey and it was, like, instantaneous.
Leslie Johnston [00:20:36]:
Yeah.
Leslie Johnston [00:20:37]:
I mean, I think on their, like, second date, he was talking about how he wanted to marry her.
Leslie Johnston [00:20:41]:
Yeah.
Leslie Johnston [00:20:41]:
And now had some time to, like, develop. Like, they were long distance for a little bit. But I think there's a difference between their scenario of, like, they were in it fast.
Leslie Johnston [00:20:54]:
Yeah.
Leslie Johnston [00:20:55]:
But to me, I go, but they both came from early. Probably Joey, but Christie came from a spot where she was actually. Okay.
Leslie Johnston [00:21:03]:
Yeah.
Leslie Johnston [00:21:03]:
Before.
Leslie Johnston [00:21:04]:
Yeah.
Leslie Johnston [00:21:05]:
So I think sometimes it's like, I think that people can fall in love really fast.
Leslie Johnston [00:21:08]:
Yeah.
Leslie Johnston [00:21:09]:
Like, we see people all the time where they're like, I just knew it was the person.
Leslie Johnston [00:21:13]:
Yeah.
Leslie Johnston [00:21:13]:
Or I knew. So.
Leslie Johnston [00:21:14]:
Yeah.
Leslie Johnston [00:21:15]:
I guess what's the difference between knowing it's your person.
Leslie Johnston [00:21:17]:
Yeah.
Leslie Johnston [00:21:18]:
And being just so desperate for. Desperate to have somebody.
Leslie Johnston [00:21:25]:
Yeah.
Leslie Johnston [00:21:26]:
Like what? I guess.
Leslie Johnston [00:21:27]:
Yeah.
Leslie Johnston [00:21:27]:
In your thoughts, what are, what are more signs, I guess that you can go, oh, this is. This is a good thing, not just a desperation thing.
Morgan May Treuil [00:21:34]:
Well, it's funny because we were. We were just. I wish he would. I wish he would eventually come on and talk about it because I just think he. His perspective would be great. But he won't, because he will. He just can't. But we were having a conversation with friends the other day about when Benji and I started dating.
Morgan May Treuil [00:21:52]:
And I actually almost called you in the middle of it to have you back me up on something because I was.
Leslie Johnston [00:21:58]:
I will always back you up, even if it's false.
Morgan May Treuil [00:22:01]:
But this was. But this was true. And we were having a group conversation. I don't remember how it was, how it started. We were talking about how. How I was probably the most anxious I had ever been for lots of reasons. A, because I always have a default setting of kind of anxiousness. But also, if you think about it, I had six months prior, had moved, you know, across the country, changed states, left my family behind, left kind of everything I had known, and was doing something new and different.
Morgan May Treuil [00:22:32]:
And I think that delayed grief is a real thing. So I think that I probably didn't start to process some of the grief of leaving behind family and life in Texas until maybe even six months after I moved here. Because at first you're just in survival mode and you're just trying to get through it.
Morgan May Treuil [00:22:47]:
Yeah.
Morgan May Treuil [00:22:47]:
And then eventually you kind of come to terms with like, oh, my gosh, what did I just do? What does this mean? So then I start dating Benji right around that same time, I think, where I'm starting to process those things. So I feel anxious for so many reasons.
Leslie Johnston [00:23:01]:
And.
Morgan May Treuil [00:23:01]:
And I was very anxious when we started dating. And he would say that that was a huge problem in our relationship that needed to be solved is how anxiously attached I then was to him. But I was challenging him on that because I also felt like in that season, he was very emotionally avoidant. And we always had that conversation of, like, you feel like you're pulling back and almost like making it really hard for me to know where I stand with you.
Morgan May Treuil [00:23:33]:
Yeah.
Morgan May Treuil [00:23:33]:
Which then makes me more anxious. And then I'm try. Like, I would say of those two things, he was more of like, the ghosty type of. I'm going to kind of keep her guessing as. Not that he was intentionally saying this, but, like, I'm going to. It felt like he was being more so, like, I'm just not sure where I stand. So I'm going to be like, half in, half out. And then I think I was doing more of, like, the love bombing, you know, exaggerated.
Morgan May Treuil [00:23:59]:
Not that I would have intentionally called it this, but, like, I was doing more of, like, the exaggerated gift giving and making all this effort to hang out and to make plans and to. You know, I probably overdid, and then he probably underdid, but we both blamed that on the other person.
Morgan May Treuil [00:24:16]:
Yeah.
Morgan May Treuil [00:24:17]:
So, like, I think I was overdoing because he was underdoing, and he thinks he was underdoing because I was overdoing.
Morgan May Treuil [00:24:22]:
Yeah.
Morgan May Treuil [00:24:23]:
So I think all that to say I think about that, and I think both of us, at the time that we started our relationship were not in healthy spots with ourselves. I think that I. But again, like, I think God redeems all of it. So it's like.
Leslie Johnston [00:24:39]:
Yeah.
Morgan May Treuil [00:24:40]:
Like, now it's. It's a totally different story. Yeah.
Leslie Johnston [00:24:42]:
You don't have to have a perfect.
Morgan May Treuil [00:24:44]:
A perfect start.
Leslie Johnston [00:24:45]:
Dating start. Yeah.
Morgan May Treuil [00:24:46]:
For it to work. But I think that was a huge. Like, when you said that, I was like, oh, that actually makes a ton of sense because I think we have both had stuff that we had not worked through that contributed to us entering the relationship with, like, a false start. I think, on both of our. On both of our ends.
Morgan May Treuil [00:25:03]:
Yeah.
Morgan May Treuil [00:25:04]:
And so anyways, that was just a side note for anybody who's in this and you're like, I really do feel like I'm starting to date somebody who I genuinely like. But some of this stuff is resonating with me where I feel like one of us is really in and one of us feels really out or. Or flip that. Vice versa. And you're not sure what to do with it.
Morgan May Treuil [00:25:25]:
Yeah.
Morgan May Treuil [00:25:26]:
I think what you just said is really important. You have to assess where you, as an individual are coming at the relationship from. And then I think the second thing you have to start thinking through is, does this feel sober or does this feel whirlwind? Like, you know those friends where they take off on their big romantic journey towards someone and it feels whirlwindy, but not. Not in a. Like, not in a good way.
Morgan May Treuil [00:25:59]:
Yeah.
Morgan May Treuil [00:26:00]:
Like, I think about the. The fast nature of, like, you talking about Joey and Christie's, and that didn't feel whirlwindy. It felt sober.
Morgan May Treuil [00:26:07]:
Yeah.
Morgan May Treuil [00:26:08]:
Like it had logical proof to attach to it. There are some things that do feel really like, swept. Like you're swept up in something.
Morgan May Treuil [00:26:17]:
Yeah.
Leslie Johnston [00:26:17]:
If I feel like signs. If you're swept up in not a good way is like, if your friends are like, she's nowhere to be found.
Leslie Johnston [00:26:25]:
Yes.
Leslie Johnston [00:26:26]:
Because you're swept up in this. Or all of a sudden what you normally spend time doing, and whether it's hobbies or church or serving or your work or whatever, if all of a sudden all of those things are getting no attention.
Leslie Johnston [00:26:43]:
Yeah.
Leslie Johnston [00:26:44]:
Like, to me, the person you're with, I think you can be swept up in a good way with somebody, but to me, like, that person should be wanting to be in the areas of your life.
Leslie Johnston [00:26:54]:
Yes.
Leslie Johnston [00:26:55]:
Like, your friends should know the guy.
Leslie Johnston [00:26:57]:
Yes.
Leslie Johnston [00:26:58]:
Your work, not. I mean, your church where you serve. Like, they should be jumping in Right. Into your world.
Morgan May Treuil [00:27:05]:
Into your world.
Leslie Johnston [00:27:06]:
If you're getting swept up out of your world.
Leslie Johnston [00:27:08]:
Yes.
Leslie Johnston [00:27:09]:
That might not be.
Leslie Johnston [00:27:10]:
Yes.
Morgan May Treuil [00:27:10]:
Healthy. Like, what do you think. What do you think about the thing where it's the. The classic new relationship thing where you're just together all the time? Like.
Morgan May Treuil [00:27:19]:
Yeah.
Morgan May Treuil [00:27:19]:
People say it's like a thing. You lose your friend for, you know, four months while they get through the honeymoon phase. They do everything together.
Morgan May Treuil [00:27:26]:
Yeah.
Morgan May Treuil [00:27:28]:
Is that.
Leslie Johnston [00:27:28]:
Is that.
Morgan May Treuil [00:27:29]:
Is that normal? We've kind of normalized that, but it doesn't feel very healthy. It feels like, in that case, if you notice that a person's trying to pull you out of your rhythm and your routine versus supporting you in that.
Morgan May Treuil [00:27:42]:
Yeah.
Morgan May Treuil [00:27:42]:
And jumping in with you. I know that there's like, the romantic thing of, you know, oh, well, it's just. It's all so fresh and so new.
Leslie Johnston [00:27:50]:
Yes. Like, some. Some of. That's just bound to happen. Like, you have a new person in your life who you want to spend all your time with. So I think it's like, we don't want to beat ourselves up with the fact of wanting to be with that person more. And you are trying to figure out if you're going to move forward or not. But again, I think if you're not, if that person's not showing interest and you're not maybe even allowing them to come into your life.
Leslie Johnston [00:28:15]:
That's something I will say sometimes in relationships I've been in, if I have felt like, oh, the friendships I have or family or what I was involved in, if I ever thought, like, ooh, I don't know if they're going to think that that is cool or they'll fit in or they'll. Whatever. I have almost separated the two a little bit and pushed like, oh, no, no, no, that's fine. Like, I'm leaving that behind a little bit and not allowing them to come into my life to really get to know me.
Leslie Johnston [00:28:47]:
Yeah.
Leslie Johnston [00:28:48]:
I think sometimes we want to put up this facade of what I'm like. Or if they're different than you, you want to put up this facade of, like, no, I'm just like, you, Like, I'm so cool. I'm just like, you know, and to me, it's like, that's a little bit of a red flag.
Leslie Johnston [00:29:02]:
Yeah.
Leslie Johnston [00:29:02]:
If they. If you're not allowing them into your life early on.
Leslie Johnston [00:29:05]:
Yeah.
Morgan May Treuil [00:29:06]:
Oh, 100%. I think you have to put almost like a timestamp on the honeymoon phase and say, if I still feel like I am changing my schedule, not being present with my friends.
Morgan May Treuil [00:29:19]:
Yeah.
Morgan May Treuil [00:29:20]:
Holed up with this guy or this girl after three months of dating, like, I feel like I've actually changed my schedule and sort of like, who I am and who I do my life with.
Morgan May Treuil [00:29:32]:
Yeah.
Morgan May Treuil [00:29:33]:
That's the time to look at that and be like, okay, wait, this doesn't feel so much like a phase anymore. This feels like I got hijacked or I got swept up in something. And either there needs to be a kind of a bring. Like a bring it down to reality conversation where we decide what kind of couple we want to be.
Morgan May Treuil [00:29:52]:
Yeah.
Morgan May Treuil [00:29:52]:
What kind of individuals we want to be. Or maybe it's a good time to be, like, am I still who I am in all of this, or did I just totally get changed?
Leslie Johnston [00:30:01]:
Which I have always appreciated. Michael has always been, like, a big cheerleader of me for, like, my work, my job, like, my friendships, the things I'm doing, this podcast, like, stuff like that. So I do think you want your. You shouldn't lose, like, your individuality. Individualness or what individuality yes.
Leslie Johnston [00:30:23]:
Yes.
Leslie Johnston [00:30:23]:
Because they should be cheering you on in what you're doing.
Leslie Johnston [00:30:26]:
Yes.
Leslie Johnston [00:30:27]:
So there shouldn't even be a now. Maybe your time is not as often that you can be with your friends or doing the things that you love, but to me, it's like those things should grow.
Leslie Johnston [00:30:38]:
Yeah.
Leslie Johnston [00:30:39]:
Because that person is with you.
Morgan May Treuil [00:30:40]:
You really set see what kind of a partner they're going to be when you watch how they interact with your priorities, your passions and your people. I didn't mean to alliterate, but that's. That's huge. And. And to Michael's credit, that was. That is very true. Like, I remember when y' all first started dating and it felt like we did a lot of things together.
Leslie Johnston [00:31:04]:
So much together.
Morgan May Treuil [00:31:05]:
I remember he got us Christmas gifts for our first Christmas. Like, not just you, but got stuff for like everybody in our house. And. And that is a really cool character thing that not many people have because I feel like a lot of times guys come in and they feel insecure about their place in your life. So then the possessive tendency of like, come away with me. It's not so much that they don't like your friends, it's that they feel insecure about losing you. They're not trusting with you, and so then they don't. They only feel validated when they can pull you out of your thing and make you like their thing.
Morgan May Treuil [00:31:39]:
Yes.
Morgan May Treuil [00:31:40]:
And so if a guy is really supportive of your friends, really supportive of your work, if he is, you know, obviously it's not a bad thing for them to want one on one time with you, you know, on a weekly basis or whatever. But if they're like really good about integrating into your life, that's a really good partnership sign that they're somebody who will. Will stand the test of time. Because life is not about just the two of you being a unit by yourselves, floating away from everybody else. Like, that's. I feel like that's what these, like some of these movie love stories are made up of, where it's like, we're just gonna run away together and go. No one understands us. We're gonna go do our own thing.
Morgan May Treuil [00:32:22]:
Often. Like very Twilight vibes.
Morgan May Treuil [00:32:24]:
Yeah.
Morgan May Treuil [00:32:24]:
Which part of me loved.
Leslie Johnston [00:32:25]:
Yeah.
Morgan May Treuil [00:32:26]:
And wanted. But that's not what real life is. Real life is like you. You create your unit and then you add to it.
Leslie Johnston [00:32:33]:
Yes.
Morgan May Treuil [00:32:34]:
Yeah.
Morgan May Treuil [00:32:34]:
And I had this thought. Tell me if you think this is this, this is a theory. Because I was thinking back to why I was. Why I was so hands on and pushy and anxiously over attached to Benji. And I think part of it is how he was towards me. So I think we're both unhealthy and pushing against each other, But I also think that that was a control mechanism for me. I felt like if I would overdo it and be, like, really sure that he knew how I felt about him, if I communicated all the time and showered him with, like, gifts and words of affirmation and all these things, I felt like me doing that would almost force him into a response to give me that same affirmation.
Morgan May Treuil [00:33:24]:
Yeah.
Leslie Johnston [00:33:24]:
It's like you're showing him how to do it.
Morgan May Treuil [00:33:26]:
I'm showing him how to do it. I'm taking control of the situation.
Leslie Johnston [00:33:29]:
And.
Morgan May Treuil [00:33:30]:
And then in the end, I get the validation that I need.
Morgan May Treuil [00:33:33]:
Yeah.
Morgan May Treuil [00:33:34]:
To keep moving forward, which feels at its core like a control issue. Like, I was unwilling. It was like my actions were only being done to re. To get a reciprocated action.
Morgan May Treuil [00:33:47]:
Yeah.
Morgan May Treuil [00:33:48]:
I wasn't doing those things.
Leslie Johnston [00:33:49]:
Like, I'm giving to get a little bit.
Morgan May Treuil [00:33:51]:
I'm giving to get.
Morgan May Treuil [00:33:52]:
Yeah.
Morgan May Treuil [00:33:52]:
100. Like, that was what it was. It wasn't. When I look back on that time and how, like, verbally affirming I was, how much I did, how much I cooked, how much I gave, I look back on that stuff and I don't remember a lot of it being done, because that was my love language. Even though for some people it is.
Morgan May Treuil [00:34:09]:
Yeah.
Morgan May Treuil [00:34:09]:
I remember honestly doing that, and this is embarrassing and, like, not great. I remember doing those things only out of fear. I wanted validation that I wasn't about to get left. And so I would do those things only to, like, basically cast a net and see if I could catch some affirmation back or some whatever.
Morgan May Treuil [00:34:31]:
Yeah.
Morgan May Treuil [00:34:32]:
I'm not him, so I can't speak for him, but I would guess if we asked him, the distance he created was also a control and fear response of, like, if I will ghost a little bit with my texting, with my words, I won't commit as much. I won't have as much skin in the game. I can't get hurt in that. And so I do think that why we do the whole, like, either the love bomb or the ghost thing, and we're obviously talking about more than just those individual actions. We're talking about, like, a posture in relationships.
Morgan May Treuil [00:35:07]:
Yeah.
Morgan May Treuil [00:35:07]:
I think the reason we do those things has so much more to do with the fear and the insecurity that we're fighting in ourselves than it has to do with the other person.
Morgan May Treuil [00:35:18]:
Oh, yeah. Yeah.
Morgan May Treuil [00:35:19]:
And the Reason why we have to be really cautious when we see someone doing these things, especially in dating relationships, is you have to decide if that insecurity they're feeling is something they're willing to acknowledge and work through or if it's something that is going to eat them alive and eventually eat you alive.
Leslie Johnston [00:35:36]:
Yes.
Morgan May Treuil [00:35:37]:
Because they're not aware of it and they don't want to work on it.
Morgan May Treuil [00:35:39]:
Yeah.
Leslie Johnston [00:35:40]:
Well, tell them because I remember you saying something. This was like when you guys maybe first got engaged. It was like kind of a revelation you had where you were. Like, I always thought I wanted somebody who would do all the things that kind of. You were doing.
Leslie Johnston [00:35:59]:
Yeah.
Leslie Johnston [00:35:59]:
But I remember you saying something about like, actually, Benji is the opposite of what I thought I wanted in that way. But it was what I needed because I put that person.
Leslie Johnston [00:36:09]:
Yes.
Leslie Johnston [00:36:09]:
Too high.
Morgan May Treuil [00:36:10]:
100.
Leslie Johnston [00:36:11]:
Yeah. Yeah.
Leslie Johnston [00:36:12]:
Talk about that a little bit. Because I remember being like, mind blown. I was like, that's so good.
Morgan May Treuil [00:36:15]:
I. I just, I remember feeling like whenever I got healthy and I started seeing a counselor probably six months before we got engaged, just me and he started seeing one too. I don't think his worked out as much. But then he ended up getting help in kind of a different way with some community. But I. I got really. Basically kind of gave up control and was like, hey, I. I'm.
Morgan May Treuil [00:36:39]:
My best efforts are not making this work, so I'm going to kind of surrender it. I think we took, you know, a 48 hour break or something.
Leslie Johnston [00:36:47]:
I remember that.
Morgan May Treuil [00:36:47]:
Yeah. So traumatizing.
Leslie Johnston [00:36:49]:
Which actually was really brave of you. And something that I think other girls or guys listening who go, I feel like I'm in a spot right now where like, I could never give it up because I'm too scared of how I would feel maybe after. But you actually did that.
Leslie Johnston [00:37:06]:
Yeah.
Leslie Johnston [00:37:06]:
Even you wanted to be with Benji, but you felt like I have to do something almost like to give this up to God.
Leslie Johnston [00:37:13]:
Yeah.
Morgan May Treuil [00:37:14]:
It felt more about me and I.
Morgan May Treuil [00:37:14]:
Gave back to you.
Leslie Johnston [00:37:15]:
Yes, exactly.
Morgan May Treuil [00:37:16]:
It felt more about me needing to be like, I am okay without this and I'm committed to growing without this. And so I endured it. Whatever. However we did that.
Morgan May Treuil [00:37:27]:
Yeah.
Morgan May Treuil [00:37:27]:
And started seeing a counselor and basically got to the point where I. And what I loved about her and how she helped me walk through it is I went to her basically being like, these are all the problems in my relationship and I want to get this fixed. And she was able to see through all of that and see to the root cause of. You're not content or secure in something in you. And if that's not figured out, then your relationships will always suffer. Right. And so I ended up getting to a place where. And I think it was just through, like, time deconstructing it, really, like, investing in.
Morgan May Treuil [00:38:08]:
In my relationship with God.
Morgan May Treuil [00:38:10]:
Yeah.
Morgan May Treuil [00:38:10]:
It got to a point where it was like marriage, and specifically marriage to Benji. It got removed from whatever idol it was placed on. It was the number one thing I cared about, the number one thing that I felt like was going to make me feel safe. And to be honest, towards the end of that time period where I was really struggling, even having him wasn't making me feel safe anymore because I still felt so stressed out in our relationship.
Morgan May Treuil [00:38:36]:
Yeah.
Morgan May Treuil [00:38:37]:
So it's like being with him isn't working. Being not with him. I didn't think that was gonna work, but now it's like, none of it's working. So then it got to a point where it was like, okay, that's been removed from the pedestal. And then once it did, I realized actually I don't even, like, all these ways of like. Like, relating that I was trying to force. I actually don't want him to be obsessed with me or, like, love bomb me all the time. I actually don't.
Morgan May Treuil [00:39:08]:
I don't. I actually don't like any of that stuff. Like, and I'm not even actually that good at those things anymore. I don't actually enjoy doing those things. So I feel like, like, all of it comes down to, like, when you strip out the fear of it all. And fear and fear and idolatry are really, like, closely related together. Because when you fear something bad happening to you, you're going to put a leader up in your life that you think can lead you out of whatever that bad thing is that's happening. And so if you're worried about being left or that you're not going to get married and you will put a man or a woman up on the idol or that, like, pedestal in your life because you think they'll lead you towards commitment in marriage, and that will lead you out of heartbreak and being left, and then that's actually not true in life, I think.
Morgan May Treuil [00:39:53]:
What. When you get rid of the idol because you've dealt with the fact that it's a real fear, then you start to realize, oh, I don't know, that I needed any of those things that I was fighting so hard to get. And in fact, God actually knew more of what I needed than I did.
Morgan May Treuil [00:40:09]:
Yeah.
Morgan May Treuil [00:40:09]:
The ways that he is. He was steady and simple and faithful. Benji was. Is loyal. And all of those things are things that matter so much more to me as a sober, more healthy person.
Morgan May Treuil [00:40:25]:
Yeah.
Morgan May Treuil [00:40:26]:
Than before.
Leslie Johnston [00:40:27]:
Totally. Like, even knowing you now, for however many years, five years I looked like. Yeah. I remember thinking on your wedding day even, because I feel like I got to walk through all of those different seasons with you. And I remember on your wedding day being like, it's so cool that Benji it. Like the things that you thought you wanted aren't actually anything that you really needed and wanted.
Morgan May Treuil [00:40:54]:
No.
Leslie Johnston [00:40:54]:
Yeah.
Morgan May Treuil [00:40:54]:
Because you're.
Leslie Johnston [00:40:55]:
You're totally, like, independent and you. You didn't like someone who love bombs you all the. I think you would be like, I'm getting suffocated. No.
Morgan May Treuil [00:41:03]:
Yeah. This is too much. Which is fun. Like, God kn. So true.
Leslie Johnston [00:41:07]:
God knew that. And it's like, everybody's different. So, like, that might not work for somebody else. Like, they want all those. The. All the love bombing, whatever things. But it was funny to watch as, like, oh, no, you can, like, you can trust that God knows what you need and that sometimes I think we'll always still fall into the comparison of other relationships and things that you do. Like, that we do that our partner doesn't do.
Leslie Johnston [00:41:31]:
Whatever. But it's like at the end of the day, who you're with and eventually who you marry. And if you're a Christian, you believe, like, hey, this is like a covenant now. It's like if you can look towards the things that's like, recognize the ways that God has put you two together and the things that they bring to your life. Because there's so many of those that God has like, crafted.
Leslie Johnston [00:41:55]:
Yes.
Leslie Johnston [00:41:56]:
But a lot of times we focus just on the things that maybe they're not doing or that are, you know, lacking or still need to grow in or whatever.
Leslie Johnston [00:42:03]:
Yeah.
Leslie Johnston [00:42:04]:
But I love that that's such a good, like, process from feeling controlled by that and needing that to then like, oh, no, I've kind of let go and it actually worked out.
Leslie Johnston [00:42:18]:
Yeah.
Leslie Johnston [00:42:18]:
Like, it's a great story, too, of somebody. If there's somebody listening, going, I feel like I'm trapped in the. I don't want to be left. Like, is this ever even going to work out with this person? Like, I really do think this is the person that I want to marry. But, like, it just doesn't seem like it's working. There actually might be a way through that where you guys do end up.
Leslie Johnston [00:42:38]:
Yeah.
Leslie Johnston [00:42:38]:
Together. Or it's not. And, you know, you figure it out. The boat keeps Coming as the boat always keeps coming.
Morgan May Treuil [00:42:45]:
Always says, yeah, you don't, you don't want it if it's not going to be healthy. No, no. And I think we try to force, sometimes force things that are not healthy because it feels like, gosh, I just can't lose this. But if you get it and it's not healthy and it ends up destroying you both.
Morgan May Treuil [00:43:02]:
Yeah.
Morgan May Treuil [00:43:02]:
Then you've kind of lost it anyways. Right.
Leslie Johnston [00:43:05]:
How does someone know the difference between that you think?
Morgan May Treuil [00:43:09]:
Between, between like.
Leslie Johnston [00:43:11]:
Because I think everyone in, in dating feels like if there's turmoil, a lot of times people just give up.
Leslie Johnston [00:43:17]:
Yeah.
Leslie Johnston [00:43:18]:
And they go, this just isn't working.
Leslie Johnston [00:43:20]:
Yeah.
Leslie Johnston [00:43:20]:
But how do you know if it's like, oh, this is unhealthy or this is just something we need to work through and maybe I need to just work on myself and they need to work on themselves, but we are better together. It's kind of a million dollar question.
Morgan May Treuil [00:43:33]:
No, I think, I think that I really hope people come to church on the weekend that we start talking about this. But we're, we're in Ephesians right now and Ephesians 5 starts to bring up this idea of submission, which is a really bad, like, not great word culturally, I feel like, because usually people think it applies just to women and it's just for marriage. But the idea is that submission is the way of Jesus because he submits to God. And it submissions really close to surrender too. But for your whole life, your health and relationships is dependent upon how much you're willing to submit and serve somebody else versus fighting for yourself. That's the opposite. And we've been doing this since forever. Right.
Morgan May Treuil [00:44:25]:
Like, it's like the fights with your siblings all are birthed because you want something your way or now or you want that thing for yourself. And then learning submission is. I actually don't care as much about me. I care more about them. So I think what's the biggest question I would ask anybody who feels like they're going through a really hard time in their dating relationship and they're trying to decide whether it's a push through thing or a pullback thing is have you started with you and all the things that come with you? Right. Because it could very much be them or it could be a combo of you together that doesn't work. It could be a values thing that doesn't match up or line up. It could be, you know, a temperament thing.
Morgan May Treuil [00:45:12]:
There's a million things that don't make that, that make people not compatible. So that's all part of it. But if you feel like you see how it could work, but it's just not working, I think the first question is, like, where are you at? And what are the habits or the things that you're negatively contributing to the relationship that are birthed out of a place of fear or pride or idolatry?
Morgan May Treuil [00:45:36]:
Yeah.
Morgan May Treuil [00:45:37]:
And if you can sort through some of that and they. And you're. And you're. You're thinking about marrying somebody who also knows the Lord and would do that for themselves, too, then I think that's when you know. But if you've. If you've done the work to figure out, like, these are the things in me that are problematic, but I'm making steps to fix them. And granted, like, we. We use this language a lot in our house, and I don't know if this is good language or not, but sometimes we'll have, like, a repeating fight, and one person will assume the other person feels something or means something without knowing that for a fact.
Morgan May Treuil [00:46:16]:
And then we'll come back with it and say, well, you don't know that I actually feel that way. Like, you don't know that that's actually what I meant. And the other person will be like, well, you trained me to think that when this happens, you mean this because this is how you always used to do it before. So when someone goes to the effort to change something about their rhythms or their, you know, cycles with conflict, you have to give them some space to actually, like, make the change and see if it works.
Morgan May Treuil [00:46:44]:
Yeah.
Morgan May Treuil [00:46:44]:
But if you feel like you've given space to the person to. To change and to grow and it still feels like nothing's working.
Morgan May Treuil [00:46:54]:
Yeah.
Morgan May Treuil [00:46:55]:
Then maybe that's the distinction. But I think all. All relationships stop because when people pull out because it's hard, it mostly has to do with the fact that they are not considering, like, their role in it. They're mostly just, like, looking at the relationship as the other person is the problem.
Leslie Johnston [00:47:15]:
Yes.
Morgan May Treuil [00:47:15]:
This does not work for me. I'm going to remove myself. What do you think?
Leslie Johnston [00:47:19]:
Well, I think we could probably do a whole episode on, like, can people change?
Morgan May Treuil [00:47:23]:
Right.
Leslie Johnston [00:47:24]:
Because that would be. I think you don't marry for potential. You marry who it is at the time.
Leslie Johnston [00:47:31]:
Yes.
Leslie Johnston [00:47:32]:
Because most of the time they say your fights will be your same fights your entire life.
Leslie Johnston [00:47:35]:
Yeah.
Leslie Johnston [00:47:36]:
And. But I also do think people can change. I think people can move and shift. And I've watched, like, tons of people in my life and people I've dated And people who I just have known who, they have changed so much. But to me, like the common denominator and all of that is like they have an active relationship with God and they are willingly submitting their pride and are willing to change.
Leslie Johnston [00:48:05]:
Yes.
Leslie Johnston [00:48:05]:
Those are the people that change.
Leslie Johnston [00:48:07]:
Yes.
Leslie Johnston [00:48:07]:
So it's like if you're dating someone and there are some pretty big issues and almost some deal breaker issues, but they're not admitting it and submitting to God, they're not going to change.
Leslie Johnston [00:48:20]:
Yes.
Leslie Johnston [00:48:21]:
But if they are, then it's like, hey, maybe, maybe walk down that road and see if things can change.
Morgan May Treuil [00:48:27]:
Yeah.
Leslie Johnston [00:48:27]:
Because I really do think people can grow and change. But I don't think you marry for that. No, I think you marry who it is now.
Morgan May Treuil [00:48:33]:
And that's, that's what dating is for, is figuring that stuff out. Like, and we've had Kevin Thompson before on, and that's why he says his recommendation is date for at least a full calendar year. Because at that point you've gotten through your honeymoon phase and you started to see some of the real habits, families of origin, some, some like, yes. That are just in you that you didn't know about. And the ugly stuff starts to come out and then you get to the better. The better measurement is not actually watching like what the ugly stuff is that comes out. It's watching what people do with the ugly stuff that comes out of them.
Morgan May Treuil [00:49:09]:
Yeah.
Morgan May Treuil [00:49:09]:
And if there's someone who, like you said, submits himself to God and therefore is willing to grow and change, that's probably the most marryable quality you could look for in a person is someone who is willing to become someone different. I mean, we wouldn't, we wouldn't believe in what we believe if we didn't say like, anyone can change.
Morgan May Treuil [00:49:31]:
Yeah.
Morgan May Treuil [00:49:31]:
That's the whole point of the gospel.
Morgan May Treuil [00:49:33]:
Yeah.
Morgan May Treuil [00:49:33]:
But it is a choice to change and it's a choice to be humble enough to admit when you're wrong and walk in a different direction. So that's like the number one trait that everybody listening to this should be. This number two trait anybody should be looking for is like, do they love Jesus? And are they humble enough to grow to be like him and grow away from themselves? From themselves.
Leslie Johnston [00:49:55]:
Yeah. It's like, then Jesus, like, die to yourself. Like, that's.
Leslie Johnston [00:49:59]:
Yeah.
Leslie Johnston [00:50:00]:
Number one thing we should be doing. And if the person you're with is not going to do that. That's why I think anybody who goes, oh, it was like love at first sight. We just knew within like a month of Dating. I'm like, so have you seen the ugliest parts of them?
Morgan May Treuil [00:50:17]:
Right.
Leslie Johnston [00:50:18]:
Have they been that honest with you that you're willing to go, I can show, like, grace and mercy just like God. Because they, they would have to be so honest with you for you to see the ugly and be like, I believe that God can still work through this.
Leslie Johnston [00:50:33]:
Yes.
Leslie Johnston [00:50:34]:
If you, if you haven't listened to Joey and Chrissy's episode, go back a couple of. Because they talk about that and how honest he was with her. When they first started dating, he laid out, like, everything to her. And I think that's why they ended up getting married so quickly is because she knew what she was getting into, but she saw that as like, oh, this is him laying down his pride.
Leslie Johnston [00:50:56]:
Yes.
Leslie Johnston [00:50:57]:
And us being able to work through this stuff.
Leslie Johnston [00:50:59]:
Yeah.
Leslie Johnston [00:50:59]:
So to me, it's like, if you're like, oh, it's just so perfect, like we're getting married because he seems perfect, then I would say you definitely need.
Morgan May Treuil [00:51:07]:
To wait a year. No, wait.
Leslie Johnston [00:51:08]:
Get to know the person. There's no harm in waiting. No, there's no harm in waiting.
Morgan May Treuil [00:51:12]:
But seeing someone's brokenness and seeing how they respond to it, especially if, if done in a short period of time, that is grounds for a healthy, fast moving.
Morgan May Treuil [00:51:22]:
Yeah.
Morgan May Treuil [00:51:23]:
Relationship.
Morgan May Treuil [00:51:24]:
Yeah.
Morgan May Treuil [00:51:24]:
It's the ones like you said, that are more swept up because a person is perfect.
Morgan May Treuil [00:51:29]:
Yeah.
Morgan May Treuil [00:51:31]:
Where you'll, you'll get 10 years down the line and you'll figure out what was broken, but at that point, it's too late to change.
Leslie Johnston [00:51:37]:
Yeah.
Morgan May Treuil [00:51:38]:
It's too late. If you figure out that they don't do well with their brokenness and they don't submit it to God, at that point it's too late. So that's, that's the thing, right?
Leslie Johnston [00:51:47]:
Yeah.
Morgan May Treuil [00:51:48]:
I love that.
Leslie Johnston [00:51:49]:
This is a great conversation.
Morgan May Treuil [00:51:50]:
If you're not in a relationship, though, the thing you should be working on and fixating on, if you're, if you're in a relationship, then these things need to be evaluated. This is all research. Right. If you're not in a relationship, then, then this is the perfect time to start. Like, again, like, starting with you. Right. So what are the things that I'm the most scared of? How am I prone to be an idol worshiper?
Morgan May Treuil [00:52:13]:
Yeah.
Morgan May Treuil [00:52:13]:
And then I'm gonna start fixing those things now so that I come into this relationship with as few fears and baggage as I possibly can. Like, I would evaluate. Do you feel like you're a love bomber by personality trait or do you feel like you're a ghoster by personality trait. Yeah. And those could easily be translated into like anxious attachment style and avoidant attachment style. So you're either you respond to fear by going all in and like overdoing it, or you respond to fear by going all out and under doing it. Both are unhealthy.
Morgan May Treuil [00:52:44]:
Yeah.
Morgan May Treuil [00:52:44]:
Both won't, won't help your relationships flourish. So while you're sitting here with no one, fix that. Because that's the stuff that has to be fixed by yourself anyways.
Leslie Johnston [00:52:54]:
So.
Morgan May Treuil [00:52:54]:
True. You'll fix it by yourself whether you're in a relationship or not.
Morgan May Treuil [00:52:57]:
Yeah.
Leslie Johnston [00:52:58]:
And maybe a tangible thing if you know you're like an anxious attachment style type of person. I think you need to have a friend or somebody who you can go, hey, these are my things that I'm not gonna negotiate on. Like, these are my deal breakers for things. Not that the person has to be perfect, but I would say because I'm, I'm probably a little more similar to you. Like, I like being with somebody. Like, I, I, I, I don't like, I would not want to be alone. So to me, I'm like, oh, I could see myself attaching onto somebody.
Leslie Johnston [00:53:31]:
Yeah.
Leslie Johnston [00:53:31]:
Quicker. And I've seen that in the past until I actually had people in my life where I'm like, hey, these are the things to me that are non negotiable. I need you to help me, like, as I go into my next relationship when I felt like, oh, I'm afraid that I'm gonna cling on too fast. I need you to be the person that's like, hey, are they this way?
Leslie Johnston [00:53:52]:
Yep.
Leslie Johnston [00:53:53]:
Are they growing in their relationship with God? Are they really good treating you respectfully? Like, are they these things? Because if they're not, like, you need accountability.
Leslie Johnston [00:54:03]:
Yes. Yeah.
Leslie Johnston [00:54:04]:
To help you get out when you know it's not right.
Leslie Johnston [00:54:08]:
Yep.
Leslie Johnston [00:54:09]:
So I would say that's, that might be a good starting point if you're single and you want to be in a relationship.
Leslie Johnston [00:54:15]:
Yep.
Leslie Johnston [00:54:15]:
And you have some good friends that can hold you.
Leslie Johnston [00:54:18]:
Yes.
Leslie Johnston [00:54:18]:
That would probably be a good conversation to have.
Morgan May Treuil [00:54:20]:
We should do a whole episode on council.
Morgan May Treuil [00:54:23]:
Yeah.
Morgan May Treuil [00:54:24]:
Because I have heard stories, most stories I have heard about people when they are being counseled against a relationship. It's like the people are coming to them in masses saying that they don't think this is a good idea.
Leslie Johnston [00:54:39]:
Oh, yeah.
Morgan May Treuil [00:54:40]:
And that's usually correct. And we should talk about that because I think people have a hard time with that.
Morgan May Treuil [00:54:45]:
Yep.
Leslie Johnston [00:54:46]:
And like, what's good counsel what's bad.
Morgan May Treuil [00:54:47]:
Counsel, who should be a part of your council.
Leslie Johnston [00:54:51]:
We should all have council committees.
Morgan May Treuil [00:54:53]:
We should all have committees. I love it. Let's do that.
Leslie Johnston [00:54:56]:
We'll do that next. We'll do that podcast sometime really soon.
Morgan May Treuil [00:54:59]:
I like it.
Leslie Johnston [00:55:00]:
This is great.
Morgan May Treuil [00:55:00]:
I know. Thanks for joining us. And am I doing this right? And hopefully you got something out of this, whether you're dating or you're not or married or any of those things. And you can follow us on Instagram at. Am I doing this right for all the fun that's happening over there.
Morgan May Treuil [00:55:17]:
Oh, yeah.
Morgan May Treuil [00:55:18]:
And you can like and subscribe and rate this podcast and leave comments because we read them all. The good and the good and the bad. Exactly.
Leslie Johnston [00:55:26]:
That's so funny.
Morgan May Treuil [00:55:27]:
Okay.
Leslie Johnston [00:55:28]:
All right. We love you guys.
Morgan May Treuil [00:55:29]:
Next week.
Leslie Johnston [00:55:29]:
See you next time.
Morgan May Treuil [00:55:30]:
Bye.